Casual EDH Ban List - Comments

[Comment Bot]

Casual EDH Ban List

[Qyngxie]

I love Banlists, and in fact I've made a few of my own.  I certainly hope this is a very early draft.  I could build an entire Deck out of just the broken stuff you DIDN'T ban, but I'm not really the type to do that.

[HeyMagic]

This is most definitely a first draft . Our meta is non-combo, and we want to improve the diversity of the played decks or cards. Mainly because most staples are auto includes in their respective colors.

As for non-combo broken stuff, what do you have in mind?

[storrent]

he bans Exotic Orchard but not Command Tower
who hurt you that bad by playing WUBRG that you had to ban every rainbow land

[HeyMagic]

Hey, storrent. The reason for banning rainbow lands was to make 5c lose some speed compared to 2-3c. This is mainly motivated by the lack of hate cards in casual edh (back to basics, blood moon). If you can play 5c without any downside, something is wrong.

[Qyngxie]

This is most definitely a first draft . Our meta is non-combo, and we want to improve the diversity of the played decks or cards. Mainly because most staples are auto includes in their respective colors.

As for non-combo broken stuff, what do you have in mind?

Well, it's really mostly a matter of banning a lot of cards but without banning the even better versions, unless I've misunderstood and this stacks with the existing banlist (which wouldn't explain overlap like Karakas, Panoptic Mirror and Sundering Titan).  Just for a few examples in no particular order: Worldfire but not Sway of the Stars, Necropotence but not Yawgmoth's Bargain, Notion Thief but not Hullbreacher, Jeweled Lotus but not Black Lotus, and Intuition but not Gifts Ungiven.  There are many, many more.

ETA: I'd link my own banlist for reference, but I'm in the middle of a major overhaul that I only just yesterday realized was necessary.

[smurge]

This seems like far more than just a ban on combo cards.
Its more a complete ban on any of the classic bombs as well, also anything that is remotely powerful.
You banned Wilderness Reclamation for god sakes, why?

[HeyMagic]

@jlutzxinc: The list was initially seen as an add-on to the official ban list. Some cards ended up being there based on the data collection process from edhrec (salty cards, top played cards) and the cedh staples list. I have added a section of banned in edh to solve this problem. Could you link your ban list?

@smurge: It is indeed far more than just a banlist on combo cards. For that you could include rule 0 of "no infinitive combos" in your playgroup. However, we wanted to create a list that allows low to medium-power-level decks with extended card diversity to exist in our playgroup. For that reason, we banned wilderness reclamation & seedborn muse.

[smurge]

@HeyMagic the issue with your ban list is that its highly inconsistent.
You have banned a bunch of mana doublers for whatever reason yet missed out on Extraplanar Lens and Caged Sun as well as the half dozen or so mana doublers in black.
There are also still atleast another half dozen extra turn spells you missed, all of which do basically the exact same thing as the extra turn spells you have added.

Almost every card on your list has some degree of redundancy in the form of other cards that do similar things that you haven't added.
It wouldn't take much of a seasoned player to build a truly horrendously potent deck entirely around your rules, Im pretty sure if I removed a sol ring from one of my decks it would do precisely that. The most this ban list has done is prevent CEDH level decks from walking in due to your ban on most of the mana rocks used at that level of play.

My point being is that prohibition is stupid, if you want to stop people from ruining things then you are better off fostering an environment where people can ruin things in a fun supportive and safe way, much like drinking.

[HeyMagic]

@smurge: I think your main point is that you believe prohibition is stupid and that every ban list is unnecessary. I'm afraid I have to disagree. Our playgroup uses this ban list as a guideline for achieving a medium-powered meta and thus far has been successful with it. If something comes up that we don't want to see anymore, it gets banned as well. We might introduce "banned as commander" precisely for that. Which deck would break the meta, in your opinion?

The mana doublers banned are the ones that double every color. Single color mana doubling is fine. Therefore, Extraplanar Lens and Caged Sun are not banned. As for the extra turn spells, we banned the cheap (5 cmc) and repeatable ones (no exile).

[Qyngxie]

@jlutzxinc: The list was initially seen as an add-on to the official ban list.  Some cards ended up being there based on the data collection process from edhrec (salty cards, top played cards) and the cedh staples list.  I have added a section of banned in edh to solve this problem.  Could you link your ban list?

I'm sorry for taking so long to reply; it looks like you addressed my concern.  My Banlist DESCRIPTION shows that my group also adheres to several other Banlists, but the list ITSELF is only for cards that either aren't on them or are there for the wrong reason (but still should be).   Your solution is equally valid.

ETA on the next day (so I don't double post, apologies in advance for length):
It occurred to me that you might like to see a few OTHER reference lists of mine.  The first I've made especially for your review.
The second I made a long time ago, but I've made it relevant here via the first's description.
And the third isn't directly relevant but it may help you navigate your format independently of any bans.
Please click on the links (especially for the second one), because there are many additional notes in the comments that are only visible via the Overview tab.  Again I apologize for the late reply.