deckstats.net
You need to be logged in to do this.
The buttons above will open in a new window. Please return to this window after you have logged in. When you have logged in, click the Refresh Session button and then try again.

Author Topic: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts  (Read 1316 times)

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« on: June 26, 2023, 07:52:21 pm »
Looking for some help as I am down the rabbit hole again on "good stuff" vs "is this right for the deck".  There are some high CMC cards but i feel the ramp here is pretty good.  Would love some tips on pushing this past the finish line!

Giada Lifegain tribal


Rose the Budget Queen

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 72
  • Karma: 78
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2023, 08:35:34 am »
I realize this is a posted a few days late, but here you go anyways :P

Archangel Elspeth - As much as I love her and the fact they finally made her an archangel... sadly she doesn't sync well with the deck. Her + ability doesn't really help much as you already are super creature heavy, while her 2nd ability is good, most of your creatures are already angels, so it's not overly helpful. Finally, her last ability has like zero utility as most of your creatures are way over 3 CMC.

Always Watching AND Thraben Watcher - Lord Effects aren't overly helpful when you're already producing masses of +1/+1 counters PLUS there is already a ton of vigilance in your deck.

Crashing Drawbridge - Right now I don't see an actual value for it as your deck doesn't seem to NEED haste. Please disregard if there is an actual reason for it that I'm not seeing!

You have 2 Aura of Silence 1 in Removal and 1 in Stax.
Also 2 Well of Lost Dreams 1 in Card Advantage and 1 in Lifegain
Also 2 Mangara, the Diplomat 1 in Card Advantage and 1 in Lifegain

Rogue's Gloves - I know you already have a lack of card advantage, but I feel like this doesn't get you nearly enough to justify a spot in a deck where space is already cramped.

Ravnica at War - Unless you're playing a ton of multicolored decks in your usual group, I feel like this card is too specific for its 4 CMC

Twilight Shepherd - Awesome art, but I feel like unless you are losing a ton of creatures during your turn she's not super useful, especially if your stax prevents opponents from playing anything on your turn.

Maskwood Nexus - You only have 9 Non-Angel creatures in the deck. While the 2/2 Shapeshifters would create more "Angels," they lack flying, which your deck seems to capitalize on. Plus you already have quite a few Angel generators.

I have more suggestions, my brain just needs to process the rest of your deck. :P

Edit: Not a cut, but a suggestion: Take out 1 SCPlains for Karn's Bastion. Proliferation FTW.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2023, 09:09:00 am by Rose the Budget Queen »

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2023, 05:47:21 pm »
Thanks for the tips!  Making some quick changes.  Regarding always watching and thraben watcher - do you think it is worth taking out both?  I've found vigilance and haste to be unsung heroes in commander, especially in 1v1 which is what I play more of.

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2023, 05:51:23 pm »
Made a few more cuts based on suggestions.  Hopefully just need to sleep on it and figure out the last 15 to cut to make this competitive.  I feel this deck needs to ramp FAST and hit quickly


Revision 2

Added/removed cards:
-1 Always Watching
-1 Archangel Elspeth
-1 Crashing Drawbridge
-1 Maskwood Nexus
-1 Rogue's Gloves

Changed amounts:
-1 Aura of Silence
-1 Mangara, the Diplomat
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Ravnica at War
-1 Well of Lost Dreams

paulusdeboself

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
  • Karma: 57
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2023, 07:34:23 pm »
I'm considering building a Giada deck as well (in stead of my Linvala angel deck: https://deckstats.net/decks/104951/2447066-linvalas-flying-friends#show__spoiler). I don't have the more expensive angels so I would take a slightly different take on angel-tribal. I would focus more on the cheap (in mana-cost) angels and less on the big ones. And without a pearl medallion I use Oketra's monument. It's one mana more and only for creatures, but because I will be playing a creature heavy deck it's quite good (and the card is less expensive in €'s). And the it gives out 1/1 warrior tokens on top of the manadiscount. And it also triggers my Tocasia's Welcome. That's another card I would recommend. It triggers of all tokens each turn (The book of exalted deed, Valkyrie Harbinger). A bigger angel I would recommend is Emeria Shepherd, it works great with landtax and uses the recursion from white.

And for your cuts you could look at the cards that aren't angels. You have lots of cards that give lifelink to your creatures. Many angels have lifelink already or give life for playing angels (Bishop of Wings, Lyra Dawnbringer, Rightous Valkyrie), so you don't need Abzan Battlepriest, Heliod and such. The same goes for the planeswalkers, they can make angels, but you have better ways to do that (The Book of Exalted deeds, Valkyrie Harbinger).

And you could consider cutting the 'stax and tax' pieces. You could beat face with big flying angels and gain life in the proces, i don't know your meta, but is it really that necessary to prevent your opponent from attacking you if you gain enough life to live trough that. Especially when playing 1vs1 commander.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2023, 07:40:06 pm by paulusdeboself »

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2023, 04:51:56 pm »
Thanks for the advice! Made a couple of changes.  Was debating Tocasia's Welcome but wasn't sure how great it would be since it is just once per turn.


Revision 5

Added/removed cards:
-1 Abzan Battle Priest
-1 Authority of the Consuls
-1 Elspeth Resplendent
-1 Heliod, Sun-Crowned
+1 Emeria Shepherd

UrizenII

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 52
  • Karma: 70
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2023, 08:05:50 pm »
I have an Orzhov Angel tribal deck with Liesa, Shroud of Dusk as the commander (though Liesa, Forgotten Archangel works as well).  The deck is 75% white, so there's a lot of overlap here with mine.  Just going section by section:

Card Advantage - Definitely thin, but that's white.  You should run Smuggler's Share.  People drawing two or more cards per turn in commander is fairly common, and it also gives you a chance for limited ramp.  The problem with it is that it is not always reliable or consistent draw and often feels like a do-nothing 3-drop, but it's something that people are probably not going to waste removal on so you will eventually get value from it.  You could consider something like Cosmos Elixir as well since you're leaning into the lifegain.  Firemane Commando is also worth a look (it is an Angel), as well as Tenuous TruceIcon of Ancestry isn't exactly draw, but it gives you a bit of card selection.  I would cut Angelic Sleuth.  Not only does it rely on your stuff leaving the battlefield - and without many blink effects, that means dying (which you don't want to happen) - but also you still have to pay the additional 2 mana and sac the clue to draw each card.  I like that you included both War Room and Bonders' Enclave in your lands.

Bombs - Akroma's Memorial doesn't seem the most efficient to me (though it is flavorful).  All those keywords are nice, but a bit redundant; you already have flying on everything and consequently probably don't really need Trample, are already running other things that give Vigilance, and are already bigger than most things such that you don't need First Strike (it might be useful if you're facing Demons or Dragons, but at that point you already have the problem of playing against Demons or Dragons).  The haste and pro-black/red is nice, yes, but I don't think it's worth the loss of tempo for playing a 7-mana artifact.  Likewise with True Conviction.  I know it's a finisher, I'm just not fond of the card because of the cost.  I'd almost rather have a Coat of Arms or Door of Destinies.  If you feel you need more combat support, consider things lie Angelic Skirmisher, Brave the Sands, or Sigarda's Vanguard.

Life Shenanigans - Shattered Angel is definitely not a good card, but I shoehorned it into mine anyway.  You should also be running Seraph Sanctuary in your lands.  Speaker of the HeavensAngelic Accord or Resplendent Angel?  If you're running Test of Endurance, might as well play Felidar Sovereign too.  Otherwise, you don't actually have too many cards that have or grant lifelink, so maybe cut Test?

Protection - Seems fine, though I would like to see Swiftfoot Boots too.  Mandate of Peace is an interesting tech, but probably one of the weaker cards in this section.  Same with Silence (opponents can still respond to the Silence being cast).  Rebuff the Wicked is a card I like but can never seem to find a spot for in my decks.  Consider Kindred Boon.

Ramp - Archangel of Tithes is not ramp.  It's a fine angel, but it is not ramp.  I'd consider cutting Quicksilver Amulet.  I run Belbe's Portal in my deck, and most of the time I just never play it because the one-turn tempo loss of paying 8 for an Angel that probably costs less so that I can maybe play one per turn for only 3 in the future never seems to be the best play.  Sword of the Animist would be fine.  Consider Archaeomancer's Map and Keeper of the AccordNyx Lotus is also great.  I keep mentioning tempo loss, but 4 mana to tap for far more than that a turn later is a huge swing, and people are going to be reluctant to use removal on a mana rock most times.  I run Gilded Lotus in my deck and tried Thran Dynamo, but cut the latter and might cut the former too.  Cryptic Gateway is fine if you're going wide, otherwise it can end up leaving you more open than you would like.  Good tech though that not many people seem to know about (at least not before the reprint).  Monologue Tax isn't great, but there if you're desperate.

Recursion - All good.  Maybe cut Twilight Shepherd.  It's a little slow.  I toyed with it in mine and it just felt clunky.  Not sure about Cauldron of SoulsDawnbreak Reclaimer is an interesting card but is also a little clunky.

Removal - You're in mono-white, so Mass Calcify would be worth a look.  I tend to shy away from boardwipes like Cleansing Nova in Angels just because they're so expensive to get back out onto the field.  Excise the Imperfect is another good spot removal card.  There are also Angels that do removal, though often it is temporary.  E.g. Angel of Sanctions, Angel of Serenity, Admonition Angel, Angel of the RuinsAura of Silence isn't bad but serves as more of a stax card (see below).

Staxish - This is the section I would focus on trimming down.  If you want to play stax, play stax (like taxes Liesa).  You're playing Angel tribal, so you should be trying to beat face.  Angel of Jubilation, Angelic Arbiter, and Linvala, Keeper of Silence are fine.  Smothering Tithe is taxes, but I always include it with ramp because almost nobody ever pays for it.  Even Magus of the Moat would be OK because it fits your deck.  Personally, I would cut everything else.

Utility - Like with Sleuth, I'm not sure about The Ozolith; it needs your creatures to leave the battlefield to do anything.  I guess the threat there is that you make a giant beater if anyone ever wipes your board, and 1 mana is an amazing investment for what it does, but I'm not sold on it.  Angel of Condemnation is fine because it's a sort of weird modal recursion/removal card, but I found it too clunky in my deck.  You're a mono-colored deck so you would want to run Caged Sun (or Gauntlet of Power), but I found it to be far too slow.  By the time I have enough mana to cast it and benefit from it, I was either already too far behind or didn't need it.

Untagged - Serra the Benevolent can be considered utility.  Serra Ascendant is not an angel but is an amazing card especially on turn 1 in commander, so that's fine.  Youthful Valkyrie is good.  Helm of the Host does not seem necessary nor like it fits with the deck.  Sure, two (or more) Giadas would be nice, but you're paying 9 mana for that.  Just cast another beefy angel instead.

Lands - I'd consider going up to 35.  I'd cut Maze of Ith.  Can't tap for mana and doesn't really do much to help your deck.  Hall of Heliod's generosity is also something I'd consider cutting since you don't run too many enchantments (but I see you, sneaky Test of Endurance at instant speed).  Similar logic for Serra's Sanctum (though if you have the card, I understand wanting to run it just to flex and because it has a high ceiling).  Homeward Path... I guess if your playgroup meta runs a lot of steal effects?  Opal Palace doesn't seem necessary.  Path of Ancestry would be better for a tribal deck.  Also not sure if Rogue's Passage is necessary considering you run exclusively flying creatures.  Eiganjo, Seat of the Empire is not one of the better Channel lands, but you're running enough Legendary creatures and it taps for white by itself that there's not really a reason to not include it.

Lastly, where are Battle Angels of Tyr?  If you're leaning into lifegain, Ajani, Strength of the Pride is a solid value (4 mana to exile all opponents' creatures and artifacts, or worst case +1 to gain life).  There are other interesting techs that I don't run but thought I would list: Angel of Finality, Angel of the Dire Hour, Blinding Angel, Resolute Archangel, Subjugator Angel, and Sunblast Angel.

EDIT: I'm an idiot.  I forgot Giada gave +1/+1 counters and not static +1/+1, so suddenly Ozolith, Cauldron, and Sleuth seem much better.  I still don't think I would include any of them.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2023, 08:52:54 pm by UrizenII »

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2023, 02:34:54 pm »
Thanks SO MUCH for the detailed analysis and suggestions!  Going to go through it all this weekend and finalize the deck. Can't wait to play it.  The next one in my list to make was a Liesa taxes deck, which looked like a lot of fun


Revision 7

Added/removed cards:
-1 Angelic Sleuth
-1 Archon of Emeria
-1 Cleansing Nova
-1 Ghostly Prison
-1 Maze of Ith
-1 Opal Palace
-1 Quicksilver Amulet
-1 Twilight Shepherd
+1 Ajani, Strength of the Pride
+1 Battle Angels of Tyr
+1 Blinding Angel
+1 Eiganjo, Seat of the Empire
+1 Excise the Imperfect
+1 Felidar Sovereign
+1 Icon of Ancestry
+1 Mass Calcify
+1 Nyx Lotus
+1 Path of Ancestry
+1 Resplendent Angel
+1 Seraph Sanctuary
+1 Smuggler's Share

Changed amounts:
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Containment Priest
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Grafdigger's Cage
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Rest in Peace
-1 Snow-Covered Plains
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Spirit of the Labyrinth

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2023, 10:58:29 pm »
Adding Humility to the maybeboard.  Can be fun, since my crits rely on counters to get pumped up, so they would definitely be stronger.

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2023, 11:21:28 pm »



Revision 16

Added/removed cards:
+1 (SB) Metropolis Reformer

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #11 on: July 07, 2023, 11:25:35 pm »



Revision 18

Added/removed cards:
+1 Sublime Archangel

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2023, 11:33:02 pm »



Revision 21

Added/removed cards:
-1 Rogue's Passage

Changed amounts:
-1 (Main) +1 (SB) Homeward Path
+2 Snow-Covered Plains

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2023, 10:41:10 pm »



Revision 24

Added/removed cards:
+1 Reprieve

pendraggon87

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Karma: 1
  • Decks
Re: Giada Lifegain tribal - Need a few cuts
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2023, 05:25:37 pm »