Deckstats Forum

English-language Forums => Deck Reviews => Topic started by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 03:08:58 am

Title: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 03:08:58 am
Green-White (http://deckstats.net/decks/62951/467198-green-white)

Suggestions welcome.

I'm mostly looking for cards that augment the strategy of this deck. I don't want to modify it too much in terms of the actual playing of the deck. Also, no sideboard suggestions please, since I play casual.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 03:16:52 am
For commenters:

I know that this is very enchantment-heavy. I also know there are 61 cards. I don't think these are very big problems, but if you think they could be, please do tell.

I'm a bit concerned with the mana curve and the early-game. I think the mechanic itself by which this deck operates is pretty good though, and I don't want to make things more complicated by adding more mechanics.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 01:55:55 pm
Any good cat cards to add? I like cat cards.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 12, 2016, 03:07:31 pm
     There are TWO card sets or blocks that I would like for you to take a look at. One is called Shards of Alara and the other is called Theros. Both blocks have cards that tie into your themes.

     As far as the deck build goes it's not bad, just try adding more cards that have enter the battlefield triggers for the enchantments or cards that get stronger because of the number of enchantments that you have (for example ethereal armor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ethereal+Armor)). Also if you like cat's then try to add more LION creature to the deck, it'll make the tribal theme a lot better and more cohesive for you.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 03:17:25 pm
@G.Moto
I have looked at those blocks, but I actually would like cards that not just add +1/+1 or something, but +1/+1 counters. Then I have things like kalonian hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) doubling those or death's presence (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Death%27s+Presence) moving them after creatures die.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 05:05:30 pm
I have a specific question:

Do you think Behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) works with this deck, or is archetype of courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage) better?
I think archetype of courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage) is slightly better, since it is both a creature and an enchantment and will trigger both types of abilities. Also, abzan battle priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abzan+Battle+Priest) can give lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) to almost all of my creatures.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 12, 2016, 06:01:35 pm
  Honestly I think the behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) would be a better choice. Reason being, not that many people run artifact removal, and it gives any one of your creatures 3 different bonuses while the enchantment creature only gives one and takes from the opponent. Now if you want +1/+1 counters then Return to Ravnica is full of those kinds of cards. All of the GREEN guilds from Ravnica include some form of +1/+1 counter production and can work wonders when used in the right combinations. Cards such as burst of strength (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Burst+of+Strength), crowned ceratok (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Crowned+Ceratok), forced adaptation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forced+Adaptation), ivy lane denizen (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ivy+Lane+Denizen), and others would be good for your deck. They make your creatures strong and they provide excellent combat tricks.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 12, 2016, 07:37:37 pm
ok...

Then which is better for my deck:
Behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) or crowned ceratok (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Crowned+Ceratok)? I like the idea of trample on most of my creatures, but the sledge gives 2 additional buffs. Or maybe back to archetype of courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage)? If i have archetype of courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage) combined with bow of nylea (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bow+of+Nylea), then I can kill almost any creature before it even attacks me back.

Also, which is better:
Pacifism (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pacifism) or Arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest)? Maybe one of each?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 12, 2016, 10:11:53 pm
  I would run the crowned ceratok (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Crowned+Ceratok) in the main board and side board the behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) (the additional buffs are cool but if your deck focus is +1/+! counters then you'll get a better long term investment once it hits the field). But if you have the bow of nylea (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bow+of+Nylea) you can use that as a +1/+! counter producer and start getting some good triggers for all your creatures. As my final decision: Main board the ceratok and the bow, side board the sledge and the archetype of courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage). Then just arranged them as you will when you start playing.

     As for the two white enchantments I would prefer the Arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest) over the Pacifism (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pacifism) because it neutralizes your target without having to deal any damage to it (or even destroy it for that matter). Any creature you put it on becomes a giant paper weight. Adding auramancer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Auramancer) to your deck will help will the spell recycling.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 03:43:25 am
Ok thanks! I don't think I will order the Crowned Ceratok (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Crowned+Ceratok). I will also have to disagree with you about the Archetype of Courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage), since with my Herald of the pantheon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Herald+of+the+Pantheon), it really is only a 2-drop. If i have a lot of other stuff out, it triggers almost every ability on the other cards. And I usually play casual, so I don't think I'll be having a sideboard...
However, I do have some cards that I've already ordered that I have found to be inferior to other cards, so they are just sitting there. I have these other cards which have been switched out for various reasons and I don't plan on using them. These are the ones I had to cut, since when I was first putting this deck together, it came out to around 80 cards, but if you think these are better than any of the cards I have in my deck:

Emeria Shepherd (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Emeria+Shepherd)
Kalonian Twingrove (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Twingrove)
Hornet Queen (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hornet+Queen)
Behemoth Sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge)
Devouring Light (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Devouring+Light) x2 - This card I have played with, and I find it really struggles against blue and black decks, which use exiled cards to an advantage
Bane of Bala Ged (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bane+of+Bala+Ged)
Oppressive Rays (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oppressive+Rays)
Elvish Mystic (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elvish+Mystic) x2
Siege Wurm (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Siege+Wurm) x2
Seraph of the Masses (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Seraph+of+the+Masses) x2
Triplicate Spirits (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Triplicate+Spirits) x2
Feral Incarnation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Feral+Incarnation) x2
Raise the Alarm (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Raise+the+Alarm) x3


I am still working on this deck. I am ordering cards through amazon, but I don't want to spend too much by buying cards that I will end up switching out for other cards into my deck. I replaced both wall of essence (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Wall+of+Essence) with two suture priests, since I think suture priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Suture+Priest) can slow down the opponent's early game.

Do you think my mana curve is alright? If you look at the chart, most of my creatures are 2-drops and most of my cards in general are 3-drops. I think technically my Ghoultree (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ghoultree) is not really an 8-drop, since it costs one less for each creature in my GY. Also, do you think it's ok to have only one instant? I know a lot of other decks rely on instants, but personally, I have never liked instants. They're just too "use once then throw away." I find that enchantments are better since they (theoretically) last the whole game.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 03:57:49 am
Heh heh... What would happen if Ajani's Goldmane made an Avatar creature token and I had a Growing Ranks (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Growing+Ranks) out?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 13, 2016, 04:14:05 am
     Then you'd make creature tokens of the avatar creature token. They's all have the same effect so if your life total were say up to 35 then ALL your Ajani Avatar Tokens would have (35/35). Good idea. Also you might want to adjust the mana distribution in this deck. You're going to get mana screwed pretty hard if you don't fix it.

    Also addressing your last reply, oppressive rays (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oppressive+Rays), elvish mystic (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elvish+Mystic), bane of bala ged (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bane+of+Bala+Ged), hornet queen (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hornet+Queen) and the devouring light (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Devouring+Light) will definitely be worth keeping. Reasons being:
1) oppressive rays (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oppressive+Rays) is like a cheaper version of arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest) and turns the targeted creature into a mana sink. Trust me, nobody wants a mana sink too early in the game, it'd be the equivalent of casting a 6-drop creature and NOT being able to use any of its effects.

2) elvish mystic (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elvish+Mystic) may be a low drop but he can help with that mana push as far as your stronger spells go. Also just by giving IT the behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) (if you're still on the fence about it), it would be a (3/3) with lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) and trample. I don't expect you to swing much with it but it'll be some defense.

3) The eldrazi gets rid of PERMANENTS. This means lands, planeswalkers, creatures and even other enchantments. It'll be worth having since you've already got the mana ramp for it.

4) Hornet queen (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hornet+Queen) is flying and death touch (without the need to attack just to get death touch from your bow). Also she brings friends with her which makes it even more difficult for the enemy since they are all flyers AND have death touch as well.

5) Lastly the devouring light (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Devouring+Light), you may have negative views on it but whatever you exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) STAYS GONE (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gone). That means if a person attacks you with their legendary creature..poof! If they come at you with a (10/10) creature with trample, just pay the mana or convoke some of your creature tokens and its history.

    These are just some of my ideas on your deck, what are your thoughts so far?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 04:31:35 am
I think the 7-drops mentioned above are a bit too mana-expensive for this deck, even with elvish mystics. I don't want to go over 61 cards, so should there be one Arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest) and one Oppressive Rays (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oppressive+Rays)? Or should I just stick to two Arrests? The whole reason why i don't have early game spells for removal (or in this case making a creature utterly useless) is that usually, the creatures that are particularly menacing appear in the middlegame.

I found this new card called Phytohydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytohydra). It seems like a good card that goes well with my deck strategy, but I don't know what to replace with it. I'm thinking Phytotitan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytotitan), but Phytotitan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytotitan) is a 7/2 regen, so idk. any weak cards to pull out and replace with phytohydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytohydra)? I don't want to trim any early game cards, since i'm already thin on those.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 04:33:11 am
The eldrazi I decided to replace with archon of justice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archon+of+Justice). If I put a gift of immortality (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gift+of+Immortality) on it, I exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a creature whenever it dies, indefinitely, until it's exiled.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 04:37:15 am
How can I add land cards to a deck that's already over 60?!?!?
XD
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 13, 2016, 05:20:33 am
Let me ask you something, why do you feel like your deck HAS to be 60 cards exactly?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 05:36:45 am
Personally, no. But I've read a lot that 61+ hurts your chances for good cards and hands. I definitely don't want to go over 63, since i have exactly 9 early-game 2-drops, so that's about 1 per starting hand.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 05:42:15 am
Which is better:

Ghoultree (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ghoultree); It gets cheaper to cast as the game progresses, but it has no secondary abilities so it can't really contribute mush else to the synergy of the deck. A 10/10 for, say, 5 mana is not bad at all though.

Phytohydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytohydra); It gets stronger, and can't be destroyed by normal attacks. Also its P/T come from 1/1 counters, which fits in with my deck quite nicely. I also think this deck will be fun, since I can attack with a 1/1 5-drop (which is kinda funny in itself) and it will pretty much buff itself. Add in a Forced Adaptation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forced+Adaptation) or a Kalonian Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) and it's pretty much GG.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 13, 2016, 04:59:59 pm
 Go with the phytohydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytohydra), if it fits with the theme of the deck run with it.

       Also something about deck building; people are always going to recommend running 60 card decks because they talk about draw ratio, card probabilities, hand draws and etc.. But the thing is, this is YOUR deck. Most of my decks run between 60-70 cards and they ALWAYS perform the way I need them to. Reason why, because as long as you know how your deck is supposed to operate it won't let you down. At the Shadows over Innistrad pre-release event I had to build a deck and I really couldn't build anything concrete with the various archetypes I had (humans,werewolves,vampires, spirits, etc). Time was running out and I had to make a quick choice: I ran a 70 card, 5-color, human/spirit madness deck! First time I ever ran a 5 color deck in my life, first time I use it I went 2-0 my first match.

    I'm not telling you to go to FNM tournaments with 90 decks because I'm not you and we wouldn't build our decks the same way (also it'd be a very slim chance as far as winning goes). My point here is don't let other people's advice steer you away from building your deck the way you're comfortable with. If you know that your deck is going to be AMAZING but it runs 65 cards, RUN IT! If you know that your deck is going to feel deprived because you're forcing yourself to only run 60 cards in your deck then ask yourself, why do it? Build YOUR deck the way that you want to, and if you need to trim it down for performance purposes then we'll go from there.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 13, 2016, 09:07:04 pm
Ok so now I've got a 65-card deck, so I added 4 cards. Two of those are forest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forest) and plains (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Plains), one is another suture priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Suture+Priest), and one is the behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge). My land ratio actually went up, so I pretty happy about that. My early-game also is a bit better, since now there are 10 EG cards in a deck of 65, which is better than 9 EG's in 61. And I've got my behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) back!

I actually did feel like I was missing something when I made the cuts down to 60, 61 cards. But if I add one more card, what's to stop me from adding another, and another, and another...

I think Cheatyface (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cheatyface) is also good, since I don't have to pay the mana cost.   8)
Another super-powerful card I found is Form of the Squirrel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Form+of+the+Squirrel). Once I play it, the game is pretty much over.  ;D

On a more serious note, which is better: Retreat to Kazandu (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Retreat+to+Kazandu), or Behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge)?
Kazandu lets me gain life or put 1/1 counters, but a lot of other spells do this. It's also an enchantment.
THe sledge gives lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink), trample and +2/+2, but abzan battle priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abzan+Battle+Priest) already gives lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) and the P/T buff isn't in the form of counters.

Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 14, 2016, 05:38:57 am
   It depends on how you want to play the deck. If you are able to drop multiple lands per turn then that enchantment will put in some serious work for you. IF your focus is more on the creatures then the behemoth sledge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Behemoth+Sledge) is your best bet. However since life gain does seem like a big factor of this deck add the retreat to Kazandu (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Retreat+to+Kazandu) and work that life gain angle. Add 4 evolving wilds (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Evolving+Wilds), some swell of growth (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Swell+of+Growth) and maybe a natural connection (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Natural+Connection) or two. This way you can get multiple land drops and even battle tricks on your opponent's turns. This can be very effective for you.

  Also you know your deck better than anyone else. Add cards that will make this deck function EFFECTIVELY and QUICKLY. If you come up with any other ideas put them in the MAYBOARD on the deck builder under the interactive mode. This way you know what you might want to try out later.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 15, 2016, 06:13:57 am
So, my deck is now officially done (I think). I just have to wait for the cards to ship.

But I used the sample hand tool in the deck editor and I got a hand with 5 forest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forest), 2 plains (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Plains). A full hand of lands. Does that happen to all decks or does that mean that I have too many land cards?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 15, 2016, 06:24:31 am
   Trust me it happens to EVERYONE at one time or another. I remember I was at a booster draft for shadows over innistrad and I was playing against a pro level player. Our skills were on par but what killed me in the second round was that I kept having too many lands in all my hands or I had NO lands in my hands (and I was the one shuffling). I lost the match because of a lac of resources and good hand draws. Surprisingly though after the match we had a practice go and I beat that person then so in retrospect, my deck FUNCTIONED the way it was supposed to but I literally had some bad hands. This happens to a lot of people so don't think the hand simulator is trying to tell you something. Play your deck in person first, and if you see anything as you play THEN make your changes.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 15, 2016, 06:29:01 am
OMG my deck statistics bar graph looks like a hand.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 15, 2016, 06:35:54 am
   That is actually pretty good.....if your hand had 6 fingers. Try to stick with that because in all actually that DOES look like a decent mana curve for your deck.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 15, 2016, 07:21:50 am
If you look at the white to green mana costs, it's two-thirds to one-third, but my white to green mana sources are equally 50-50. Should there be more white than green, or should I just keep it?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 15, 2016, 07:26:28 am
  You DEFINITELY need to adjust that. Nothing worst than not having enough of the color you need.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 15, 2016, 07:28:41 am
So 14-10 should be fine, right?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 15, 2016, 07:38:41 am
   Adjust it as the color wheel changes. Balance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Balance) out the mana distribution with the mana requirements needed to run the deck. The color wheels should be similar to near identical if you can.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 16, 2016, 07:20:14 pm
Wait...
The Imposing Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Imposing+Sovereign) taps creatures when they are played by opponents. So does this card only have a real effect on creatures with haste? What is the difference between tapping at the beginning of the turn and summoning sickness.

Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: CosmicCharlie on April 16, 2016, 09:16:42 pm
It also means they can't block with creatures they just played.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: CosmicCharlie on April 16, 2016, 09:19:21 pm
As for Cat creatures Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion) and Qasali Pridemage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Qasali+Pridemage) are 2cmc good options. With its exalted pridemage can swing in for 3, also good for enchantment and artifact removal.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: CosmicCharlie on April 16, 2016, 09:21:30 pm
Also Strangleroot Geist (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Strangleroot+Geist) Call of the Conclave (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Call+of+the+Conclave), Blade Splicer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Blade+Splicer), Skinshifter (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Skinshifter) and Advent of the Wurm (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Advent+of+the+Wurm) are all good budget options. Overwhelming Stampede (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Overwhelming+Stampede) and Rancor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Rancor) are good budget buff effects. Loxodon Hierarch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loxodon-Hierarch) seems like an upgrade over Staff of the Sun Magus (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Staff+of+the+Sun+Magus)
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: aizbert065 on April 16, 2016, 09:54:03 pm
https://deckstats.net/decks/50939/471057-1-25-enchantments-wg/it

i made this few hours ago, it has no sideboard now, but i think it could be very interesting and also budget :)
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: CosmicCharlie on April 16, 2016, 09:54:15 pm
You're probably going to want to run 23 land and 6-8 mana dorks like Avacyn's Pilgrim (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Avacyn%27s+Pilgrim) and Llanowar Elves (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Llanowar+Elves) are good budget options. I'd also cut down on anything that doesn't put a creature on the field, 12-14 are the max you'll want, I'd recommended 8-12 as optimal with at least 4 control spells. I'd also cut anything above 5cmc and I'd only run 8 things that are 4cmc or higher. Something like 4-6 removal and 6 pump for spells like equipment, enchantment and stampede (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stampede) effects, 6-8 mana dorks, 6-8 cmc 2 creatures,  8-12 cmc 3 creatures and 6-8 cmc 4-5 creatures (planes walkers can also be used in this space). If you want a life gain focus make sure it's stapled onto a creature or buff to save on space, Elderwood Scion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elderwood+Scion), Loxodon Hierarch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loxodon-Hierarch) and Unflinching Courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unflinching+Courage) some good budget choices you may not have considered      (for Ocean's deck). The philosophy of most gw aggro decks is to play things that are below curve quickly so as a general guideline look for things that appear undercosted, for example Call of the Conclave (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Call+of+the+Conclave)  (2cmc for a 3/3 body) and Strangleroot geist (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Strangleroot+Geist) (haste, undying, 2 power) 
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 17, 2016, 06:24:59 am
   The deck appears to be mostly enchantments now. Is that the focus that you're leaning towards? Also make sure you either watch the mana distribution of the deck OR add creatures that produce the color that you need. Other than that the deck doesn't look that bad to me.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 17, 2016, 05:45:30 pm
Yeah, enchantments and creatures are the focus of my deck. I think the mana distribution is perfect now also.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 17, 2016, 06:37:03 pm
One last card consideration and then my deck will be complete!
I am considering buying Protean Hulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Protean+Hulk). It's a 6/6 for 7. But the cool part is that when it dies, I can search my library for ANY number of CMC-6 or under creatures and put them onto the battlefield. To further the point, EVERY other creature I have is CMC-6 or under. So once this creature dies ALL of my creatures can enter the battlefield. 20 creatures all entering (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Entering) the battlefield at the same time and attacking the next turn will probably end the game.

On the other hand, it's a 7-drop. It's so expensive to cast, and I don't plan on adding any ramping mechanics to this deck. The extra card also disrupts my mana ratio, which I think is perfect as it is. Also, having that many creatures on the battlefield might not be a good thing all the time (Mass destruction burn spells, mass infect, etc.) It's also $6. Is it worth adding to my deck?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 17, 2016, 06:46:07 pm
  A few things that I want to point out:

1) You posted the same message like 7 times already. If you want to change your post just MODIFY it, don't post it again.

2) You probably shouldn't. If your deck is finally the way you want it and things runs smoothly then keep it the way it is. Also High cost cards do not always mean high quality.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 17, 2016, 09:21:20 pm
I opened a booster pack and I got a planeswalker! But it's only half the right color: Garruk, Apex Predator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Garruk%2C+Apex+Predator). I also got a Llanowar Wastes (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Llanowar+Wastes), which would allow me to play it, as well as one Swamp (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Swamp) land. Do you think it's a good idea to splash black for the 7-drop planeswalker? If so, which cards should be switched out. and how many black lands should I have? Or should I just stick to GW?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 18, 2016, 06:44:00 am
   Keep the deck G/W and build a SEPARATE B/G deck. This way the contrast in colors don't throw off the flow of the deck. Also with the way Garruk is you can build a deck just around him as long as you have non-creature permanent bouncing/protecting cards. Really now that you have Garruk you can build a serious modern deck. Even if you just used the creatures from the core sets you'd own games.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 03:26:10 am
I want a two-of of one of these cards. Forced Adaptation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forced+Adaptation) or Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales)? Forced Adaptation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forced+Adaptation) gives a 1/1 counter each turn, but it only enchants one creature. Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) costs the same mana to cast but it adds one 1/1 counter every time one would already be put on. I don't want one of each. I want either two of one or two of the other, but I don't know which one. I'm leaning toward Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales).
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 03:31:03 am
   Go for the hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales). It'll be a better overall investment for the deck and will provide your deck with a consistency that a "single creature" enchant can not necessarily provide.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 03:46:16 am
Thanks for all your help, GMoto! I originally made an account for the deck-building tool, but I've gotten a lot of help and advice from you too.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 03:50:17 am
BTW How many turns are an average game of MtG? (Strange and vague question, I know)

I have no one-drop creatures. Do you think I will suffer a lot because of this?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 03:53:19 am
How does forum karma (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Karma) work? And how does the ranking thing work?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 04:00:18 am
    Not really, often times people just drop a land and that's their turn one. It depends n how you want to build the deck. Some aggro decks have low drops that get strong, some mid-ranged/control decks save up and keep their mana open for counter plays. As far as game lengths go that's a tricky question in itself. Reason being, different deck styles means different match ups. I usually go to set release (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Release) events and when we have our matches the FIRST game usually lasts 30-40 minutes (the entire matches are 50 minutes). I play all types of decks but the style and way I play is usually mid-ranged to aggro. Because of this I manipulate the play style and mechanics of sets and LENGTHEN the duels on purpose. By doing so I can see what's in your deck, how YOU play and what to do against similar decks in the future should I come across them. For the sake of answering the question I'll say between 10-20 rounds (back in forth between players). If it goes on longer than that then either someone is a control player, the game itself is at a stand still or no one is getting good hands. That's the honest truth on that one.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 04:04:03 am
     The ranking system works based off of how many posts you've made/replied to since you've been on the site. If you go to the MEMBERS tab you'll see the different types of forum members (New, Jr., Sr., etc). Since I've already hit 500+ post I'm a registered HERO member. You can look these up by just adjusting the column headers on the members page. The Karma (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Karma) I'd have to get back to you on that one. I'm not really sure what its used for. 
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 04:21:18 pm
My mana curve doesn't quite look like a hand anymore, but oh well.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 04:21:45 pm
What happens when two controls players play?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 04:23:50 pm
  Two control players equals one LOOONG game. The winner is usually the one who either can outlast the other person or who can play a better end game.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 04:30:55 pm
Any last revisions to the deck? The idea is that each card should be strong on its own, and at the same time have a nice combo pair with at least 2 or 3 other cards.

Also, I have always had a serious problem with control decks. I could beat any other type, but when it comes to control decks, how do I beat them. I don't want to use cards like Blue Hate cards. I don't like hate cards. I had a RG deck and one of my friends had a pure (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pure) mono-white green hating deck. After a while, I didn't like playing with that person. So I don't like color hate cards. I mean strategically, how do I beat control?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 05:03:13 pm
 There's a few ways to go about it:

1) Bait them into countering your cheap stuff and save your high cost, high value and strategy needed cards for after they run out of steam. This way you make the plays that you need without them interfering TOO much in your game plan.

2) Beat them down as soon, as often and as much as possible. They can't stop what they can't catch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Catch) so if you move faster than they can react then you've pretty much stolen the game.

3) Force them to exhaust their resources. If they have to start discarding because you're not doing anything then you're basically depleting what they can use against you. The big downside is that you don't want to give them too much space to play otherwise they'll make the board state into a field of landmines.

4) DON'T play Blue hate, just design decks around that and use the loopholes to your advantages. For example, if you know that they have a lot of cancels and your creatures usually get sent to the graveyard, build a Golgari scavenge deck (B/G) where their effects activate in the graveyard anyway. Or play a deck that has black and force them to mill or discard.

5) This is the most important advice that I can give you....NEVER give up. Control only lasts for as long as they have the steam and resources to lock down the field, but the stamina (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stamina) of the other players is also a factor as well. I've played against control decks where the other person is like "why haven't you given up yet?" Reason being, you never give up as long as you have a single card to play. Every bad or even bleak situation has a way out, sometimes just showing the person that you're not going to give up is enough to unnerve (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unnerve) them or even make THEM want to give up because they know either the match isn't going anywhere or that you're just rock solid player.

   Whether you're playing Aggro, Mid-ranged or even control, keep these things in mind. 
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 05:58:52 pm
so like Altar of the Brood (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Altar+of+the+Brood) could be good again control? It forces discarding cards. and with Profane memento (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Profane+Memento) I gain life if they discarded a creature.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 06:38:53 pm
  Yes exactly. Also the card says whenever a PERMANENT enters the field, so just by playing lands you can make them mill a card. If you play a token deck then every time a zombie token (for example) enters the field they'll lose a card every time. This card works great with graveyard recursion decks, token producers, and any deck that make you have a lot of board presence.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 09:06:40 pm
Mid-range decks are generally well-rounded decks, compared to aggro or control, right? This deck is supposed to be a midrange deck. Does it look like one? Earlier some people thought it was an aggro.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 09:10:58 pm
Control decks usually have massive creatures for the late game, aggro decks usually have tiny creatures that are mana-cost effective. I'm kinda in between. I have cards like Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion) that are quite cost effective, but I have some late game cards like Kalonian Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) and Felidar Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Felidar+Sovereign) for high casting costs. That's why I think I have  a midrange. But does it really look like an aggro? Not that I hate aggro. I played a green-red aggro before.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 09:36:31 pm
  IF your deck is in between [small/big and fast+strong] and [many and slow+controlling] then you're most likely playing a mid ranged deck. If you can do a little bit of both then you're definitely using a mid-ranged deck. The reason why mid-ranged decks work so well is because they are well rounded and are flexible enough to cope with whatever you play against.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 09:54:29 pm
I used the sample hand tool again... I'm only getting good hands about 50% of the time. (I mean at least one 2-drop creature and 2 lands) Is that normal for a deck?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 10:09:00 pm
  Sure it is, a deck is random but it also depends on how well you shuffle it in real life as well. No one is going to get a perfect hand EVERY game. But if you're not getting good hands more than you should (rather more than 65% of the time) then maybe you should adjust the deck ratio a bit or add/remove cards from your deck.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 10:14:05 pm
I supposed part of that is that I don't know when and when not to mulligan. Any tips for knowing when and when not to?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 19, 2016, 10:19:40 pm
Also, according to the sample hand tool, even if I don't get a good hand, it becomes good by the second draw about 75% of the time. Because I can't usually do anything on the first turn anyway.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 19, 2016, 10:23:33 pm
If your starting hand has 2 or less lands...Don't play it.
If your starting hand has 5 or more lands....Don't play it.
If your starting hand has 3-4 lands but all your creatures are CMC cost 5 or higher....Don't play it.
 
When you have a hand with 3 or 4 lands, the colors work in your favor and you are actually able to play cards within the first 3-4 turns of the round, that's a hand you keep.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 20, 2016, 12:11:03 am
In the deck, there are only 11 cards that contribute to lifegain (Giving lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) or direct life gain). That's a little under one-sixth of the deck.
Bow of Nylea (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bow+of+Nylea) x1
Path of Bravery (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Path+of+Bravery) x1
Profane Memento (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Profane+Memento) x1
Abzan Battle Priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abzan+Battle+Priest) x1
Loxodon Hierarch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loxodon-Hierarch) x1
Herald of the pantheon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Herald+of+the+Pantheon) x2
Suture Priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Suture+Priest) x2
Primeval Bounty (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Primeval+Bounty) x1
Felidar Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Felidar+Sovereign) x1

My 3 Ajani's Pridemate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%27s+Pridemate) rely on lifegain to become strong. The Felidar Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Felidar+Sovereign) itself also requires 40+ life to win. So is it still accurate to call the deck a lifegain deck? Does it need more? I think it still is, even though the primary strategy is to go for 1/1 counters.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 20, 2016, 02:29:51 am
Considering everything else in my deck, which is better for gaining life: Staff of the Sun Magus (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Staff+of+the+Sun+Magus) or Profane Memento (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Profane+Memento)? Or does it depend?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 20, 2016, 03:27:02 am
I'm leaning towards the Profane Memento (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Profane+Memento).
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 20, 2016, 05:31:18 am
   Add the profane memento (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Profane+Memento) and side board the staff of the sun magus (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Staff+of+the+Sun+Magus). If your deck's goal is life gain then it is a life gain deck, how it achieves this goal is up to you. Also if you add Abzan battle priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abzan+Battle+Priest) then all your creatures with +1/+1 counters will have life link. Ajani's sunstriker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%27s+Sunstriker), hopeful eidolon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hopeful+Eidolon), mortal's ardor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mortal%27s+Ardor), and swift justice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Swift+Justice) would be good cards to add as well to supplement the life link.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 21, 2016, 03:20:17 am
I have decided to replace my Phytotitan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phytotitan) with a Stuffy Doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll).
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 21, 2016, 03:52:40 am
Which would be better: A double of the Champion of Lambholt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Champion+of+Lambholt), or a Stonecloaker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stonecloaker)?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 21, 2016, 05:33:35 am
   The stuffy doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll) is really intended for decks that are good at dealing consistent damage. It would be best if you saved it for a burn deck of some sort. Also double of the champion of lambholt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Champion+of+Lambholt). Reason being, its effect says that if any creature has less power than it, ALL your creatures cannot be blocked. That right there is an investment.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 21, 2016, 08:09:46 pm
How much investment ($) should go into an average deck? Mine came out to around $90, probably since I only have 2 commons. The rest are uncommons and rares.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:00:48 am
Also, is Odric, Master Tactician (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Odric%2C+Master+Tactician) worth trading in for one of my two Hundred-Handed Ones?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: WWolfe on April 22, 2016, 04:07:32 am
Yes. Hundred-Handed One (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hundred-Handed+One) is worth about 40 cents while Odric is currently worth about $1.50.

How much investment ($) should go into an average deck? Mine came out to around $90, probably since I only have 2 commons. The rest are uncommons and rares.

It all depends on how much you're comfortable spending & can spend.

I've had decks (across different formats) that have ranged from $15 up to $800.

Decks don't have to be expensive to be formidable and fun to play.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:12:44 am
i meant in terms of the card itself, not the monetary value.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:13:49 am
I have 4 cards in my deck that require some sort of life gain to be effective (Ajani's Pridemate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%27s+Pridemate) x3, Felidar Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Felidar+Sovereign)). But I only have 11 cards for life gain... should I get rid of one of the ajani's pridemates and put in a different early-game card? Like Goldmeadow Harrier (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Goldmeadow+Harrier) or Cenn's Tactician (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cenn%27s+Tactician) or Copperhorn Scout (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Copperhorn+Scout)?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:24:48 am
On the other hand, if I drop one of the Ajani's Pridemate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%27s+Pridemate), then when I do get lifegain cards, the life gain wont really go anywhere, since the point of the game isn't to rack up life total.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:37:16 am
Which two of these four are the best fitted to my deck?
Grand Abolisher (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grand+Abolisher)
Copperhorn Scout (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Copperhorn+Scout)
Goldmeadow Harrier (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Goldmeadow+Harrier)
Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anafenza%2C+Kin-Tree+Spirit)
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 04:59:02 am
BTW I decided to keep all three Ajani's Pridemate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%27s+Pridemate). It's a decent creature by itself, even without the lifegain buffing. It'll get me through to the middle game.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 22, 2016, 05:34:34 am
   Looking at the cards in the deck I would recommend keeping the grand abolisher (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grand+Abolisher). This way at least on your turn your opponent cannot activate card effects while your trying to set yourself up on your turn. Also if your deck is focused on using life gain as a method for achieving victory rather than a win condition then you should consider adding cards such as tandem tactics (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tandem+Tactics), hopeful eidolon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hopeful+Eidolon), ondu rising (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ondu+Rising), tenacity (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tenacity), mortal's ardor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mortal%27s+Ardor), dawnbringer charioteers (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dawnbringer+Charioteers), swift justice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Swift+Justice) and angelic skirmisher (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Angelic+Skirmisher) would be good additions to the deck. This way your life link happens more often.
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 06:08:32 am
Copperhorn Scout (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Copperhorn+Scout)
Goldmeadow Harrier (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Goldmeadow+Harrier)
Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anafenza%2C+Kin-Tree+Spirit)
Which of these is the best?
Title: Re: Green-White - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 22, 2016, 06:13:11 am
Haha... If Copperhorn Scout (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Copperhorn+Scout) gets vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance), that's an untapping loop, isn't it?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 22, 2016, 06:53:39 am
2 things; 1) Yes I recommend the copperhorn scout (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Copperhorn+Scout). 2) If it has vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance) and attacks then it just stays untapped. Now every time it attacks every OTHER creature will untap so the OTHER creatures attacking with it will THEN untap. So basically your one creature is giving all your other creatures vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance).
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 25, 2016, 01:44:09 am
I just made a bunch of edits to this deck, so please take a look and give feedback.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 25, 2016, 02:58:38 am
The main focus of the deck is now 1/1 counters. Lifegain is pretty much gone (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gone).
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 25, 2016, 03:01:34 am
So did my deck as a whole get stronger or weaker? Why or how?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 25, 2016, 06:15:12 am
  The deck actually looks pretty good. You've got a game plan down and your cards seem to share a similar theme and concept. If you find some ways to add GREEN creature recursion to your deck and WHITE spells that make your creatures indestructible or just to protect them better then your deck may become a bit more sturdy.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 03:40:14 am
Yeah. So I have my two Gift of Immortality (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gift+of+Immortality) and my Loxodon Hierarch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loxodon-Hierarch) for creature recursion. Abzan Falconer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abzan+Falconer) gives flying. Archetype of Courage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archetype+of+Courage) gives first strike. Bow of Nylea (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bow+of+Nylea) gives deathtouch. And Path of Bravery (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Path+of+Bravery), Cathars' Crusade (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cathars%27+Crusade), and Frontline Medic (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Frontline+Medic) give other buffs to my cards.

As for removal spells... My Qasali Pridemage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Qasali+Pridemage) can get rid of enchantments and artifacts. My Hidden Dragonslayer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hidden+Dragonslayer) can get rid of big creatures. Archon of Justice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archon+of+Justice) paired with Gift of Immortality (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gift+of+Immortality) gives an exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) loop.

Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 03:52:46 am
Ok some questions about rules:

1. I have Ajani, Caller of the Pride (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ajani%2C+Caller+of+the+Pride) and Cathars' Crusade (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cathars%27+Crusade). I use Ajani, CotP's ultimate to summon, let's say, 20 cat tokens. So then do I get to put 20 +1/+1 counters on all my creatures? And if I have Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) too, then do I put 21 counters or 40 counters? And if I have Enduring Scalelord (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Enduring+Scalelord) as well, how many counter do I put on it?

2. With the above example, if I also have Altar of the Brood (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Altar+of+the+Brood), then does the opponent discard 20 cards from their library?

3. I have a monstrous Hundred-Handed One (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hundred-Handed+One) with and equipped Godsend (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Godsend), so it is a 9/11 with reach and can block 100 creatures. My opponent attacks with 11 flying 1/2 Bat tokens. I block them all with Hundred-Handed One (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hundred-Handed+One). But Godsend (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Godsend) lets me exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) one of them, so do I exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) before the bats deal damage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deal+Damage), or after? If I exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a bat before, then Hundred-Handed One (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hundred-Handed+One) takes only 10 damage and doesn't die, but if I only get to exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) after the damage resolves, then everything ends (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ends) up dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dead) and then I exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a bat token.

4. I have a Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion) and a Bow of Nylea (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bow+of+Nylea). I attack a Phyrexian obliterator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phyrexian+Obliterator) with my Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion) (which now has deathtouch). How many permanents do I sacrifice? 1 or 5?

5. If I morph my Hidden Dragonslayer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hidden+Dragonslayer) and destroy the Phyrexian Obliterator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phyrexian+Obliterator), I don't have to sac anything, right?

6. If I cast Arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest) on a creature, what can the creature do? Can it, for example, be tapped for Convoke? And what counts as an "Activated Ability."

7. Last one for now... If I have Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) and I cast a Servant of the Scale (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Servant+of+the+Scale), does it enter as a 1/1 creature or a 2/2 creature?





Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 04:26:41 am
I think I will be buying my cards from TCGPlayer... Anyone ever bought from there? I am getting Near Mints and Lightly Playeds. Do the cards come in pretty good condition? Not sure what a Lightly Played looks like...
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 04:31:02 am
I gave up lifegain as part of my deck, so which is better: Citadel Siege (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Citadel+Siege) or Path of Bravery (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Path+of+Bravery)?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 26, 2016, 06:07:35 am
I'm going to answer your posts backwards:

1) keep the citadel siege (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Citadel+Siege) if you're not focusing on the life gain anymore
2) I haven't purchased cards from that online site, I mostly trade or by cards off my friends.

3) With the Ajani and the (+1/+1) counters all your creatures will get a (+1/+1) counter for EACH token then +1 more token because of the hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales). So my math is this: the enchantment hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) gives each creature an extra +1/+1 counter so instead of any creature getting 20x (+1/+1) they'll be getting 40x (+1/+1) counters. That's 800 COUNTERS! Since your enduring scalelord (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Enduring+Scalelord) gets a (+1/+1) counter every time one or more counters are placed on another creature AND it'll gain double that because of hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) then it'll also gain an extra 40x (+1/+1) counters. So your dragon looks like (if I did my math right) will be gaining about 840x (+1/+1) counters.

4) Also yes to the alter of the brood, they would lose 20 cards.

5) The way that phyrexian obliterator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Phyrexian+Obliterator) works is this: YOU sacrifice permanents equal to the amount of damage you DEAL to it. So if your fleecemane lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion) is a 4/4 and kills the other monster on contact then you still have to sacrifice 4 Permanents not 5.

6) I believe that you don't. Reason being, you only sac permanents if you deal damage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deal+Damage), but if you outright destroy it then there is no damage.

7) If you cast arrest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Arrest) on a creature you can still use it for other cards' CONVOKE costs. The creature can still gain +1/+1 counters and be used for other creatures activated abilities (similar to how zulaport chainmage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Zulaport+Chainmage)  taps other ally creatures). Also an activated ability is something that you have to PAY A COST to use. For example: ulrich's kindred (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ulrich%27s+Kindred) has an ACTIVATED ABILITY because you have to PAY to use its effect.

8) your servant of the scale (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Servant+of+the+Scale) would enter the field as a 2/2 creature.

    That's all I've got for now, I hope it helps. If my math is off on the first one then I apologize in advance, it gets tricky when your stacking effects on top of one another.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 02:21:29 pm
For the 1/1 counters from the Ajani Planeswalker, none of those counters end up on the Cat tokens themselves, since they all enter at the same time, right? Also, where does 800 counters come from? Isn't it just 40 counters per other creature?

How do you remove a monstrous Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion)?
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 02:23:48 pm
For my mana color ratio, I'm not sure how to proceed. Should I go with 10 to 14 (42-58) or should I do 9 to 15 (38-62)?
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 26, 2016, 02:26:40 pm
The sample hand generator (Again!) insists on giving me Plains (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Plains) with no Forests, or better yet, no lands at all... This has happened several times in a row....
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 26, 2016, 07:00:56 pm
   For the counters your dragon gets a +1/+1 counter every time another creature would gain a +1/+1 counter. This means that it would gain a +1/+1 counter for each and every 2/2 cat token that enters the battlefield and then gets extra counters for every time EACH of those tokens gets a +1/+1 counter. On top of that your enduring scalelord (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Enduring+Scalelord) will also get additional +1/+! counters because of the hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales).

  For the color ratio take out all the mana that you have. Put in only basic lands first, then 1 by 1 add the non basic lands. This way you can see how your mana is adjusting to your deck.

   Lastly the only way to get rid of an indestructible AND hexproof creature is to either bounce multiple creatures back to the opponent's hand (without SPECIFICALLY targeting it), or make your opponent SACRIFICE it (it's like a voluntary destruction on your opponent's part without the actual destroying).
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 27, 2016, 01:19:31 am
I don't have any nonbasic lands so I just changed my mana ratio and I'm getting more of the right colors. But the ratio is less similar to my mana usage distribution than is was before.

A rules question:
I have one Hardened Scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales), a Kalonian Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra), and a creature with X +1/+1 counters on it. I attack with the hydra, doubling the counters. So does the creature now have 2X+1 counters or 3X? Also, does a +1/+1 counter and a -1/-1 counter cancel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cancel) each other or do they just both stay there on the creature?
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 27, 2016, 01:33:48 am
  Both the +1/+1 and the -1/-1 counters stay on the creature but the effects basically cancel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cancel) each other out as far as stats goes. For the hydra combo yes it would be double the +1/+1 counters and then it'll receive (+1 more counter).
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 30, 2016, 04:04:49 am
I feel like this deck needs some sort of "Ultimate" card, that costs a lot to cast... But I don't want the mana curve to be to high. Right now, my Enduring Scalelord (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Enduring+Scalelord) is my "Ultimate." Is this a good enough card? I also have Kalonian Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) and Sunscorch Regent (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sunscorch+Regent) and Stuffy Doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll). Those are pretty strong cards even though they don't cost in the CMC 7+ range.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 30, 2016, 04:28:14 am
Maybe if I added Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elesh+Norn%2C+Grand+Cenobite) in the place of the Sunscorch Regent (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sunscorch+Regent), I would have a good Ultimate.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 30, 2016, 04:32:30 pm
As for my mana color ratio, I've found that a 50-50 mix is best, even though two-thirds of my deck is white. I have a lot of early-game color-specific cost cards like Avatar of the Resolute (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Avatar+of+the+Resolute) and Fleecemane Lion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleecemane+Lion). As the game goes on I should have enough of both colors to cast what I want, but the 50-50 really helps me cast my early game creatures in the early game.
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 30, 2016, 05:14:51 pm
    I think letting the Kalonian Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) be your "ultimate" would be a better choice. Reason being, you don't have to possess an expensive card for it to be your ultimate. For example; in my old Rakdos deck I didn't have Rakdos, lord of riots (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Rakdos%2C+Lord+of+Riots) but my ultimate card was probably the hellhole flailer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hellhole+Flailer). He's got a strong body, a great effect and he serves multiple purposes. That's what you should be looking at as far as ultimate cards go. The mana cost should only matter when you're deciding how often you want to play it. Also if the mana ratio works out for you then stick to it.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on April 30, 2016, 06:04:09 pm
Oh well... I already order Elesh norn, grand cenobite (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Elesh+Norn%2C+Grand+Cenobite)... It's ok, my deck is looking pretty darn good right now. All my friends are super mad when I play kalonian hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalonian+Hydra) with hardened scales (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hardened+Scales) and champion of lambholt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Champion+of+Lambholt).
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on April 30, 2016, 06:05:53 pm
   Good job, your deck has come a long way.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on May 01, 2016, 06:53:29 pm
Any last cards to trim off my deck? I removed one Archon of Justice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archon+of+Justice) to fix my mana-ratio.
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on May 01, 2016, 06:56:25 pm
I also realized something: My Stuffy Doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll) is ABSOLUTELY fatal when it has a few +1/+1 counters on it. I had a stuffy doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll) that was a 4/5 and the opponent only had two choices: take 4 damage and lose the game or take 5 damage and lose the game. :D
Title: Re: Mid-Range GW - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on May 01, 2016, 07:01:38 pm
BTW what is the largest number of posts there have ever been in a forum thread? Because this is going on over 100!
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on May 02, 2016, 10:56:32 am
    That I'm not sure of. I've checked to see if anyone set a record for that but everything seems to be facebook and/or twitter related. Also Stuffy doll (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stuffy+Doll) is a good choice regardless of how strong it is. As long as you an keep dealing damage to it, use it as a blocker and keep it from being exiled then it's a great card to have.
Title: Re: GW Artifact - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on May 11, 2016, 02:28:28 am
Any suggestions for the deck? I would consider it a "new" deck, because it's so different from any previous versions. New focus on artifacts and counters, and incidentally, all cards except for 2-drop creatures are one-ofs. But, i find decks with one-ofs to be kinda fun and unpredictable. I think i can now correctly call this a midrange deck.
Title: Re: GW Artifact - Comments
Post by: OceanSky on May 11, 2016, 02:31:52 am
There are all sorts of threats. Milling with altar of dementia (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Altar+of+Dementia), overkill with grimoire of the dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grimoire+of+the+Dead), ping with viridian longbow (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Viridian+Longbow), sudden death (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sudden+Death) with quietus spike (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Quietus+Spike). And i have decent anti-enchantment and anti-artifact with aura shards (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aura+Shards). Also decent draw with token generation and skull clamp. A little bit of everything!
Title: Re: GW Casual Decklist - Suggestions?
Post by: G. Moto on May 12, 2016, 08:02:29 am
   The little bit of everything is important as far as strategy goes. But just remember, your deck needs a CORE in order for it to be stable and functional as well.