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English-language Forums => General Magic => Topic started by: Jabilac on September 02, 2016, 04:48:52 pm

Title: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 02, 2016, 04:48:52 pm
Spoilers are already starting to make their way onto the net for Kaladesh.  I've included the 2 that are available now and I will try to keep up with any releases over the next few weeks.  Here are our first 2.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/inventorsfair.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/saheelisartistry.jpg)

The Inventors' Fair, so far, has me worried.  I would hate to see Affinity get any stronger.  As it is right now it is considered to be one of the "Unfair" decks anyway and while I am excited to see some new cards I am really worried about the impact on Modern and Affinity.  I would like to see 1-3 of the main Affinity cards banned personally.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: KouriNick on September 02, 2016, 05:20:45 pm
Thanks for posting these Jabilac!

As far as standard goes, I'm excited to see artifact strategies emerge (no pun intended) to shake things up a bit, but for Modern it's definitely concerning. As Dredge showed us this last block, just 1 or 2 new cards can take a fringe playable deck and make it a menace! And affinity isn't exactly fringe as is. If it gets a couple new cards, it could be really poised to completely dominate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dominate) the format. \

What worries me most is Wizards will probably also print a bunch of artifact hate this set and may use that as an excuse not to ban anything from Affinity (and just force everyone else to run more artifact hate).

The other card is interesting and just shows the flavor of the set, but it will probably be a lot like Identity Thief (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Identity+Thief), just an interesting promo that highlights the theme of the set without seeing any real play outside limited.

Definitely looking forward to future spoilers!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 02, 2016, 07:10:25 pm
I feel the same way about Saheeli's Artistry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli%27s+Artistry) <---(I love this! Already tagged and working!).  Copy effects have to be cheaper to be useful.  Even using both effects it is still too dependent on the board state to be reliable.  Your either copying your stuff (Win-More) or copying their stuff (why not just destroy/exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) it) and your creating tokens which is worse that an actual copy card like Clone (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Clone).
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Warden of Silence on September 02, 2016, 08:47:26 pm
Some PAX cards have been shown. Here is a very nice one.

In case it didn't upload:

Saheeli Rai  1 Colorless, 1 Blue, 1 Red

Starting Loyalty 3

+1 Scry 1, Saheeli Rai deals 1 damage to each opponent.
-2 Create a token that's a copy of target artifact or creature you control, expect it's an artifact in addition to its other types. That token gains haste. Exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) it at the beginning of the next end step.
-7 Search your library for up to three artifact cards with different names, put them onto the battlefield, then shuffle your library.

Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: KouriNick on September 02, 2016, 10:15:53 pm
Interesting plainswalker! Izzet hasn't had one in a long time, and I'm not sure about this yet...

The -2 seems insane, especially since you can copy an artifact OR creature. creatures with ETB triggers will be crazy. Imagine -2 on a snapcaster mage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Snapcaster+Mage), Vendillion Clique or Restoratioon Angel... Seems like exactly the kind of thing Jeskai will want. +1 isn't bad since you get to scry, but definitely not a big impact effect.

She's going to be huge in commander though, copying Sol Ring (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sol+Ring) or other mana rocks to accelerate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Accelerate) out something seems good. Plus scrying and hitting everyone definitely is bigger impact in a format like that. 
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 03, 2016, 02:22:04 am
So far nothing that jumps out and makes me go wow!! I really want play this card. Granted it's still early.
The land gives colorless and life, isn't great but not bad. As previously said a 4 drop metalcraft tutor.
Blue sorcery speed that copies one or both. Maybe copy this spell with mirror pool? Who knows :)
The planeswalker, ok scrying is never a bad thing. Copying something may work well with that sorcery.
And pretty nice if you can protect her long enough to drop her final. Three artifact cards with different names, put them onto the battlefield
could be brutal. Edh play could have a field day with this and this one always comes to mind. Blightsteel Colossus (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Blightsteel+Colossus)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: ladof on September 03, 2016, 05:09:09 am
I haven't had the chance to look into it yet, but did they mention how pilot was going to work? Are the vehicle artifacts unable to attack unless piloted?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 03, 2016, 05:13:54 pm
We have a boat load of new spoilers today.  I am gonna post them first then talk about the new Mechanics.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/propellerpioneer.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/furiousreprisal.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/ovalchasedragster.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/aetherworksmarvel.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/gontilordofluxury.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/depalapilotexemplar.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/architectoftheuntamed.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/glintsleeveartisan.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/whirlermaker.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/skyskiff.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/speedwayfanatic.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/startyourengines.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/aetherstormroc.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/skysovereignconsulflagship.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/aethertradewinds.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/tasseleddromedary.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/terrorofthefairgrounds.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/fleetwheelcruiser.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/skyshipstalker.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/curiovendor1.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/cultivatorofblades.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/saheelirai2.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/rashmieternitiescrafter.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/verdurousgearhulk.jpg)


Wow that was a lot to process.  So we have Fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate), Crew, and Energy Counters as our new Mechanics so far.

Fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) - Will be seen as Fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) X and is something we have seen before just not named I.E. Sandsteppe Outcast (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sandsteppe+Outcast).  Makes X 1/1 Flyers or adds X +1/+1 counters.  Fits in with the "Crew" Mechanic

Crew - This is a new Mechanic and is kind of interesting.  It only seems to be found on Artifact Vehicles and it has a number like Crew X.  What that means is you need to tap creatures with total power of X to turn the Artifact Vehicle into an Artifact Creature Vehicle for the turn.  Its like you are putting your creatures inside the artifact and they are the crew of it for the turn.  I like the flavor of this mechanic a lot.

Energy Counters - This one was kind of confusing for me because at first I couldn't figure out what the energy counters were... Were they a token like Clues or something else.  I have interpreted this as the Player gets an Energy Counter (similar to a Loyalty counter or an Infect Counter) and you can spend these counters to create effects.  I would assume these counters can also be affected by effects like Proliferate.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 03, 2016, 08:10:33 pm
I'm getting some interesting ideas from Aetherstorm Roc and Architect of the Untamed in the standard format there is great synergy between them and Aetherworks Marvel. (Imagine bouncing Aetherstorm Roc with something like Essence Flux (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Essence+Flux) or Eldrazi Displacer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eldrazi+Displacer) ). The ramp cards from Origins and DoT will be going out soon, (Explosive Vegetation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Explosive+Vegetation), Nissa's Pilgrimage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%27s+Pilgrimage)) but there are still some good cards like Loam Dryad (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loam+Dryad), Evolving Wilds (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Evolving+Wilds), Mina and Denn, Wildborn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mina+and+Denn%2C+Wildborn), Oblivion Sower (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oblivion+Sower) to benifit from Architect of the Untamed, and it isn't even legendary!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: TheWakaEmu117 on September 04, 2016, 01:39:26 am
So since we are obviously going to see tons and tons of artifacts in Kaladesh how much artifact hate will there be? I know modern does but in standard I don't think there is a whole lot. Of course we will see some but will it be enough? Either way I am super excited for this set it looks like its gonna be a lot of fun.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 04, 2016, 05:08:14 am
I'm getting some interesting ideas from Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) and Architect of the Untamed (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Architect+of+the+Untamed) in the standard format there is great synergy between them and Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel). (Imagine bouncing Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) with something like Essence Flux (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Essence+Flux) or Eldrazi Displacer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eldrazi+Displacer) ). The ramp cards from Origins and DoT will be going out soon, (Explosive Vegetation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Explosive+Vegetation), Nissa's Pilgrimage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%27s+Pilgrimage)) but there are still some good cards like Loam Dryad (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loam+Dryad), Evolving Wilds (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Evolving+Wilds), Mina and Denn, Wildborn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mina+and+Denn%2C+Wildborn), Oblivion Sower (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oblivion+Sower) to benifit from Architect of the Untamed (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Architect+of+the+Untamed), and it isn't even legendary!

I have already started looking for Synergies myself.  I already run a Modern Flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) based deck and I am interested in Gonti, Lord of Luxury (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gonti%2C+Lord+of+Luxury) and Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel).  You are right with the synergies that you pointed out in Standard.  We are going to see some clue based synergies as well.  Its an exciting block that I hope gets better.  I like that they have pushed what we expect to appear in Magic.

So since we are obviously going to see tons and tons of artifacts in Kaladesh how much artifact hate will there be? I know modern does but in standard I don't think there is a whole lot. Of course we will see some but will it be enough? Either way I am super excited for this set it looks like its gonna be a lot of fun.  The crew Mechanic is just dripping with Flavor. 

Ya know I wish I could say that we are guaranteed to see some effective artifact removal but to be honest there is no guarantee things will get better.  The only reasonable artifact removal that will stay available in Standard after the rotation is Natural State (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Natural+State).  Lets hope we get something to destroy all this stuff :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 04, 2016, 05:25:41 am
New Spoilers :

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/ghirapurorrery.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/dieyoung.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/livefast.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/woodweaverspuzzleknot.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/concealedcourtyard.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/inspiringvantage.jpg)
 
We also have a large collection of Asian spoilers dropped but most of them were just Dual lands like the 2 posted above a Red/Blue, a Green/Blue, and a Black/Green.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/filigreefamiliar.jpg)
Filigree Familiar  3   Artifact - Fox  When it enters the Battlefield Gain 2 life.  When it dies Draw a Card.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/demonofshadyschemes.jpg)
Demon of Shady Schemes  3BBB  Creature - Demon   When it enters all other creatures get -2/-2 until EOT.  Whenever another creature dies gain E (Energy Counter)  2B, pay EEEE: Put target creature card from a graveyard onto the battlefield tapped under your control.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/territorialdevourer.jpg)
Territorial Devourer  3R   Creature - Gremlin   Trample   When you gain one or more E (energy counters) This card gets +2/+2 until EOT.

That's it for tonight.  More to come tomorrow hopefully.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 04, 2016, 06:19:35 am
I'm getting some interesting ideas from Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) and Architect of the Untamed (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Architect+of+the+Untamed) in the standard format there is great synergy between them and Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel). (Imagine bouncing Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) with something like Essence Flux (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Essence+Flux) or Eldrazi Displacer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eldrazi+Displacer) ). The ramp cards from Origins and DoT will be going out soon, (Explosive Vegetation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Explosive+Vegetation), Nissa's Pilgrimage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%27s+Pilgrimage)) but there are still some good cards like Loam Dryad (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Loam+Dryad), Evolving Wilds (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Evolving+Wilds), Mina and Denn, Wildborn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mina+and+Denn%2C+Wildborn), Oblivion Sower (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oblivion+Sower) to benifit from Architect of the Untamed (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Architect+of+the+Untamed), and it isn't even legendary!

I have already started looking for Synergies myself.  I already run a Modern Flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) based deck and I am interested in Gonti, Lord of Luxury (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gonti%2C+Lord+of+Luxury) and Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel).  You are right with the synergies that you pointed out in Standard.  We are going to see some clue based synergies as well.  Its an exciting block that I hope gets better.  I like that they have pushed what we expect to appear in Magic.

Holy hell Jabilac! This card is fricking amazing! (http://www.mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/panharmonicon.jpg), I saw it just now on MTG Salvation... You realise the potential?!  :o And you were talking about synergy between Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel)! Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) and Panharmonicon is tasty!

Can you imagine the ally triggers with Kalastria Healer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalastria+Healer)?! Crazzzyyyyy....
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 04, 2016, 04:37:17 pm
Holy hell Jabilac! This card is fricking amazing! (http://www.mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/panharmonicon.jpg), I saw it just now on MTG Salvation... You realise the potential?!  :o And you were talking about synergy between Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel)! Aetherstorm Roc (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherstorm+Roc) and Panharmonicon is tasty!

Can you imagine the ally triggers with Kalastria Healer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalastria+Healer)?! Crazzzyyyyy....

This card is nuts!  Wow I am excited about this.  Wall of Omens (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Wall+of+Omens) draw 2 cards, Lone Missionary (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lone+Missionary) gains 8 life, Blade Splicer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Blade+Splicer) makes 2 3/3 Golems, Tidehollow sculler (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tidehollow+Sculler) exiles 2 cards, Mulldrifter (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mulldrifter) draws 4 cards, Thought-Knot Seer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thought-Knot+Seer) exiles 2 cards... and the list goes on and on. Gonna be an awesome addition to quite a few decks...

I will have to face this with Ally triggers :(  I've got a friend that runs BW ally drain and I hate it soo much.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 05, 2016, 01:14:25 am
New round of Spoilers today:
 
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/813/200/283/636085891062525133.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/816/200/283/636085929848538138.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/815/200/283/636085908231349708.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/822/200/283/636086051815805627.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/823/200/283/636086088078983757.jpeg)

Nothing crazy here.  A cheap hard counter to colorless spells but nothing else.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 05, 2016, 01:59:54 am
Panharmonican with Zealous Conscripts (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Zealous+Conscripts)...or Hamletback Goliath (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hamletback+Goliath)....or.....
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 05, 2016, 07:27:39 pm
Some new spoilers today :

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/837/200/283/636086613911955888.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/839/200/283/636086653807903730.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/842/200/283/636086660519774410.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/841/200/283/636086658724837968.png)

Thats it for the english Spoilers (at least translated images)  Here are the non-English with some translation:
(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/ghirapurguide.jpg)
Ghirapur Guide   2G   Creature-Elf   2G:Target creature you control can't be blocked by creatures with power 2 or less this turn.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/cataclysmicgearhulk.jpg)
Cataclysmic Gearhulk   3WW   Artifact Creature-Construct   Vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance)   When This Card enters the Battlefield, Each player chooses among non-land permanents they control an artifact, a creature, an enchantment, and a planeswalker and sacrifices the rest,

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/trinketmastercraft.jpg)
Tricket Mastercrafter   2W   Creature-Dwarf Artificer   Servo and Thopter creatures you control get +1/+1.   3W: Create a 1/1 colorless servo artifact creature token.


Looks like Pia Nalaar is still alive (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alive).  Cataclysmic Gearhulk is pretty cool, Tragic Arrogance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tragic+Arrogance) on a big ole Vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance) Beater.  What's not to like about that :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 05, 2016, 09:48:59 pm
Pia Nalaar is alive (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alive)? It will be interesting to see what the story behind that is, and will she meet up with her daughter! Looks like Liliana is stirring up shit, haha. Apparently, Aether Revolt might be linked to Nico Bolas because of the set after is called Amonkhet (where he's from) 

Oh! And my understanding is that Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) works on triggers that are on permanents already under your control. For example, if Kalastria Healer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalastria+Healer) is on the field, already with Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon), and another ally comes in with a trigger ability (Hero of Goma Fada (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hero+of+Goma+Fada)) only Kalastria Healer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalastria+Healer)'s ability will trigger twice, and not the card entering (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Entering) the battlefield. That is my interpretation of how it works, though I could be wrong!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 05, 2016, 10:39:57 pm
It'll be interesting to see the ruling when they release (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Release) them, either way Hamletback Goliath (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hamletback+Goliath) just came that much deadlier...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 06, 2016, 04:52:27 am
Um...guys? I just saw this.... and thought $$$$$$$$$$$$ (The new Standard version of Jace, The Mind Sculptor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Jace%2C+the+Mind+Sculptor)?) Probably with a price to match!

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/126/877/636087005960239667.png)

This card would be cool in another format, it's abilities are frankly, ridiculous.
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/126/876/636087003378079642.png)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: TheWakaEmu117 on September 06, 2016, 05:07:24 am
I don't think she's quite as good as mindsculpter but maybe a standard liliana of the veil (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Liliana+of+the+Veil)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 06, 2016, 05:22:45 am
I don't think she's quite as good as mindsculpter but maybe a standard liliana of the veil (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Liliana+of+the+Veil)

Hmm, maybe. Although, if you look at the cost-benefit of Chandra she is a (4M/4L) that has a choice of doing either 2 abilities as she comes into play. The first functions like Outpost Siege (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Outpost+Siege) or Abbot of Keral Keep (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Abbot+of+Keral+Keep), except that this can be done whenever during your turn, and if you don't play that card, you get to deal 2 points of damage regardless. The second ability (+1) Mana Ramp paying for 50% of her cost when she enters, allowing you to cast something like Fiery Impulse (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fiery+Impulse) or Lightning bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt) twice? There is no disadvantage either, Liliana's +1 ability, causes (you) as well as your opponent to discard a card. Admittedly her (-3) is weak in comparison, her (-7) ability makes up for it. Which is only (+3) more to ultimate, or (+2) with Oath of Gideon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oath+of+Gideon). It is a win condition, (5 damage per spell to a creature or player) if you combined this in a tempo red/blue deck that draws and casts two cards systematically, then there is no problem dealing 10 damage per turn at the very least!

But you are correct, both are still VERY good! And are going to cost a LOT.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 06, 2016, 01:39:34 pm
That Chandra is NASTY!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 06, 2016, 03:20:57 pm
Wow! Looks like things were crazy yesterday While I was busy :)  Got a new Chandra and she is a little pushed isn't she.  4cmc for a 4Loyalty planeswalker is about what you would expect its just all the options she has that is pushing her to the next level.  The turn you bring her in you can  exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a card and cast it (Card Advantage) and even if its a land or something you can't afford to cast you still get a Firebolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Firebolt) like effect out of it, or ramp yourself RR, or remove an annoying x/4.  Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn), Thing in the Ice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thing+in+the+Ice), Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalitas%2C+Traitor+of+Ghet), Thought-Knot Seer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thought-Knot+Seer) just to name a few creature's 4 damage can kill in Standard right now not to mention all of the smaller things.  Then her -7 (possible turn 6) is a game ender.  Each spells has deal 5 damage to target creature or player stapled to it.  I want this card so bad  ;D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 06, 2016, 03:30:34 pm
New Spoilers from yesterday minus the 2 already posted here:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/869/200/283/636086946191631144.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/868/200/283/636086945883609062.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/867/200/283/636086945539637673.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/865/200/283/636086944451407806.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/872/200/283/636086953281270454.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/871/200/283/636086952935256723.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/873/200/283/636086956100672662.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/874/200/283/636086959583859851.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/875/200/283/636086971974815777.png)

Nothing of note really.  The 2 best cards from yesterday were already posted.  I am going to have to agree with you Mnemosyne Metallurgic Summonings is also kinda ridiculous.  Chandra got a lot of the attention but that Enchantment does double duty.  Turns Instant/Sorcery spells into creatures and when your outta gas pop that enchantment and bring every Instant and Sorcery card from your graveyard to your hand...  nuts
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 06, 2016, 03:41:49 pm
That harness lightning is already nasty. Any energy counters already on the field will give this card an extra bonus
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 06, 2016, 04:01:03 pm
That harness lightning is already nasty. Any energy counters already on the field will give this card an extra bonus

Especially with all the cards we have seen that give you Energy Counters.  This could end up being a catch-all style card to remove that big beater.  Too bad we didn't get a Kicker or Escalate effect for more targets.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 06, 2016, 05:13:50 pm
new Spoilers just released:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/889/200/283/636087522567614385.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/890/200/283/636087523465914222.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/891/200/283/636087524445449943.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/892/200/283/636087525523092039.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/893/200/283/636087527151186431.png)

So 2 Chandra's in 1 block... Weird.  I can't for the life of me figure out why I would use this new one over the one Spoiled yesterday... I guess the board wipe might be better against certain decks but then its so late it might not matter much.  Too bad it doesn't exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) things that die then maybe I would like it more.

Nissa reminds me of the old Garruk Wildspeaker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Garruk+Wildspeaker) because of the Ultimate.  The rest of her abilities are a little weak... Gain 3 life kinda Meh, Reveal top 2 cards and put lands on battlefield and the rest in your hand... Kinda Meh again but at least its draw and ramp all in one ability.

Lathnu Hellion might be useful as a surprise turn 3 hit and if you have enough energy stores then it will stick around and be all big and scary for a while.

Animation Module is a low grade Proliferate on a stick.  Lets you tick up planeswalkers quickly... 1 extra loyalty a turn.

Edit:  new Spoilers while I made this post :)

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/894/200/283/636087529696673324.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/895/200/283/636087532296565937.png)

All three of the Module's work together and can create a loop as long as you have mana.... Fabrication Module triggers when you gain E to put a +1/+1 counter on a creature which allows you to pay 1 Colorless and create a 1/1 servo creature which triggers Decoction Module giving you another E which triggers Fabrication Module giving you another +1/+1 counter which starts the loop again.

2nd Edit:  Another Spoiler while I was updating this post :)

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/896/200/283/636087539503422367.png)

Now this Nissa looks promising.  Make a 5/5 Elemental after you have already used a land for the turn, Return target permanent from your graveyard to your hand (almost Eternal Witness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Witness)), and last but certainly the best ability an Emblem that allows you to draw a card after each land enters the battlefield under your control.  Yes please :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: KouriNick on September 06, 2016, 06:01:38 pm
Was away for the log weekend and damn! All the good stuff comes down. Kaladesh looks like it's gong to be a very fun set so far with cards playable in nearly every format. Also, I just looked on Mythic Spoiler, and it looks like there's a second Nissa as well (sorry for no link). EDIT: The one Jabilac added above is the one I was referring to, just two Nissa's. I wonder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Wonder) if they're doing some sort of time related thing, where One Chandra and Nissa are along one timeline, and the other pair are from another? Or maybe there are 2 storylines,a nd the different Chandra / Nissa pairs represent them in each storyline?... Anyways, the cards that catch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Catch) my eye most are:

Chandra, Torch of Defiance: My main Modern deck right now is a plainswalker heavy Mardu control deck, and Chandra feels great! She does have some downsides, and odds (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Odds) are 9 times out of 10, when she enters the battlefield you'll either get the mana or kill a creature. I love that she hits for 4, meaning a lot of the creatures that pass the Lightning Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt) test will fail the Chandra test. If she survives a turn, her +1 exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) top card ability is exactly what Red wants, a way to get more gas. She's too slow for Modern burn, but I could see Jeskai or even Jund picking her up, and I'll definitely be trying to play her in my Mardu deck.

Aerial Responder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aerial+Responder): This dude is a limited bomb! he's like Vampire Nighthawk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vampire+Nighthawk) who use to win games by himself, and at uncommon, you might actually get a couple in a draft or sealed pool.

Enemy Fast Lands: Thank goodness! I was wondering when we'd finally get the other half of one of the best land sets in Modern. These things are going to be crazy valuable, and it goes without saying they'll be dominating standard and Modern, so prices will be quite high for quite a while.

Verdurous Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Verdurous+Gearhulk): 5 for an 8/8 trample!?!?! This thing is insane, and it's really looking like a Green / Red energy / counters deck is emerging.

Rashmi, Eternities Crafter (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Rashmi%2C+Eternities+Crafter): This isn't even fair... EACH turn, play a spell and Cascade (or if it's too expensive, just draw a card). The card advantage this thing produces is insane, and in Simic colors it's not like ti will be hard to play stuff at instant speed and get the effect on your opponents turn. With CoCo gone (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gone) from standard, this may be the new way Bant decks keep their ridiculous card advantage going. Scrying makes her even more insane, so maybe Temur so they can run the new U/R plainswalker and scry every turn.

Filigree Familiar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Filigree+Familiar): I actually really like this card. It's a strictly better Exultant Cultist (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exultant+Cultist) that gains life and fits in any deck. This could be a decent sideboard card if burn-type decks take off (which it looks like they might with all the awesome red cards floating around).

Can't wait to see the rest of the set!!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: TheWakaEmu117 on September 06, 2016, 08:18:03 pm
How is having 3 different nissas and Chandra's gonna work? Also the Nissa cards are a little lackluster for me
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 02:37:25 am
How is having 3 different nissas and Chandra's gonna work? Also the Nissa cards are a little lackluster for me

What do you mean by 3 Nissa and Chandra? You mean the two released in the Starter Decks, the two released as a part of the Kaladesh Set and the Nissa, Voice of Zendikar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Voice+of+Zendikar) and Chandra, Flamecaller (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Flamecaller) from the Oath of the Gatewatch Set?

There is a superfriends deck, using Deploy the Gatewatch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deploy+the+Gatewatch) and that's a thing. It uses planeswalkers as control. I mean. I wouldn't necessarily use both or the others from the Standard Legal block in one deck... I am sure people could experiment, and whether or not it would work is dependent on who you play and what they play, no?

I would agree with you, the Nissa from the Starter Set is a little lacklustre, yes. However, think about Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) for a second. As Jabilac mentioned her (+1) is a threat, a 5/5 land with haste, it allows you to un-tap a land, and then the creature stays on the field until your next turn, so you can use it as a blocker.
The (-3) is great in a delirium deck, or if someone has used a kill spell that hasn't exiled the target creature. Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder) is a popular removal spell, atm.
And finally, the (-6) which, just think about it. Nissa is a 5m/5l in your next turn she ultimates (if you decide to -6)... ONLY 1 TURN! Which means that you get to draw an extra card continuously, as long as you have a land to play, which means that it allows you to keep your hand fresh, and increases your potential to find answers to your opponents actions.

I think this card is great, and in a ramp deck with landfall, it would potential be lethal.  :)

Btw guys, Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance) has increased in value, she is now around ($40). Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) is cheaper than Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai), strangely. I don't rate Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai), because of her lack of ability to defend herself or be a great threat.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: TheWakaEmu117 on September 07, 2016, 03:41:41 pm
How is having 3 different nissas and Chandra's gonna work? Also the Nissa cards are a little lackluster for me

What do you mean by 3 Nissa and Chandra? You mean the two released in the Starter Decks, the two released as a part of the Kaladesh Set and the Nissa, Voice of Zendikar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Voice+of+Zendikar) and Chandra, Flamecaller (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Flamecaller) from the Oath of the Gatewatch Set?

There is a superfriends deck, using Deploy the Gatewatch (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deploy+the+Gatewatch) and that's a thing. It uses planeswalkers as control. I mean. I wouldn't necessarily use both or the others from the Standard Legal block in one deck... I am sure people could experiment, and whether or not it would work is dependent on who you play and what they play, no?

I would agree with you, the Nissa from the Starter Set is a little lacklustre, yes. However, think about Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) for a second. As Jabilac mentioned her (+1) is a threat, a 5/5 land with haste, it allows you to un-tap a land, and then the creature stays on the field until your next turn, so you can use it as a blocker.
The (-3) is great in a delirium deck, or if someone has used a kill spell that hasn't exiled the target creature. Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder) is a popular removal spell, atm.
And finally, the (-6) which, just think about it. Nissa is a 5m/5l in your next turn she ultimates (if you decide to -6)... ONLY 1 TURN! Which means that you get to draw an extra card continuously, as long as you have a land to play, which means that it allows you to keep your hand fresh, and increases your potential to find answers to your opponents actions.

I think this card is great, and in a ramp deck with landfall, it would potential be lethal.  :)

Btw guys, Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance) has increased in value, she is now around ($40). Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) is cheaper than Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai), strangely. I don't rate Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai), because of her lack of ability to defend herself or be a great threat.

Okay cool I can see how Nissa, Vital force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) could be good but I am still unsure but I agree even in the super friends deck the 2 started deck walkers aren't great I am excited to see how Vital Force and Torch of Defiance play.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 07, 2016, 03:54:32 pm
Isn't some of the planeswalkers going to be in the duel decks? 

You can only get those certain types of planewalkers in those decks. They aren't supposed to be overpowering but they will be only obtainable by buying the duel decks. I am not sure but that is what I heard for the rumor :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 07, 2016, 04:03:05 pm
This is going to be busted Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) with Thalia's Lieutenant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thalia%27s+Lieutenant) and Hanweir Garrison (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hanweir+Garrison). Thalia is going to become a 6/6 on turn 4. Thalia is going to be out of reach on a lot of removal by then.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 07, 2016, 04:55:39 pm
2 new spoilers for today.  1 was dropped yesterday after my post

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/898/200/283/636087594502168591.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/908/200/283/636088014231262755.png)

Paradoxical Outcome could be used for a variety of things like saving a permanent, or several, from removal or get a second use out of ETB effects all while drawing cards.

Looks like we are going to get the full set of Gearhulks.  We have already seen three Torrential Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Torrential+Gearhulk), Verdurous Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Verdurous+Gearhulk), and Cataclysmic Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cataclysmic+Gearhulk). All of those have decent ETB effects and with Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) in the works things might start getting crazy.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 07, 2016, 08:30:29 pm
New Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/912/200/283/636088383520063047.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/913/200/283/636088385379164587.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/914/200/283/636088386413020442.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/915/200/283/636088387431016150.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/916/200/283/636088388218863477.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/919/200/283/636088398077967911.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/920/200/283/636088398374900192.png)

Aetherflux Reservior seems like a fit in Soul Sisters as an alternate Win Con.

I like Glassblower's Puzzleknot the most out of the Puzzleknots but Woodweaver's Puzzleknot (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Woodweaver%27s+Puzzleknot) looks like it will fit in nicely with green's strategy after seeing Bristling Hydra along with Longtusk Cub (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Longtusk+Cub).

Almost done with the Gearhulk Series.  Noxious Gearhulk is like an upgraded Shriekmaw (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Shriekmaw) with no Evoke option, less restrictions, and lifegain stapled on.  Menace will help you close out a game faster but it is only at 4 toughness so its open for quite a bit of removal in standard Alchemist's Greeting (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alchemist%27s+Greeting), Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance), Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance), Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe), Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness), ect.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 09:36:17 pm
New Spoilers:

Aetherflux Reservior seems like a fit in Soul Sisters as an alternate Win Con.

I like Glassblower's Puzzleknot the most out of the Puzzleknots but Woodweaver's Puzzleknot (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Woodweaver%27s+Puzzleknot) looks like it will fit in nicely with green's strategy after seeing Bristling Hydra along with Longtusk Cub (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Longtusk+Cub).

Almost done with the Gearhulk Series.  Noxious Gearhulk is like an upgraded Shriekmaw (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Shriekmaw) with no Evoke option, less restrictions, and lifegain stapled on.  Menace will help you close out a game faster but it is only at 4 toughness so its open for quite a bit of removal in standard Alchemist's Greeting (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alchemist%27s+Greeting), Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance), Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance), Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe), Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness), ect.

Me: "Man, is this set even legal?"
Wotc: " Yeh it is... LOL jk! Soz, it's actually all banned!"

I know it isn't but still... Aetherflux Reservoir is a nice win condition, things like Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ayli%2C+Eternal+Pilgrim) and Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kalitas%2C+Traitor+of+Ghet) are great life ramp cards, with a planeswalker like Sorin, Grim Nemesis (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sorin%2C+Grim+Nemesis) or Nissa, Voice of Zendikar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Voice+of+Zendikar)... Urgh, it's sickening.

A nice energy combo, which I can see happening with a counter one, will make Bristling Hydra disgustingly good. Since it isn't a mana activated ability it is a reliable way to gain counters, as well as giving it hexproof? That's black done now that Languish (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Languish) is going. unless you use something like Transgress the Mind (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Transgress+the+Mind)?

Noxious Gearhulk has menace and an ETB ability? WTF? flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) this and you can extinguish (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Extinguish) someone's board state with something like Flaying Tendrils (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flaying+Tendrils) and gain life... With Aetherflux Reservoir...This makes me cry...

Even though it has (4T) you would need to cast things like Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness) and Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe) in response to Noxious Gearhulk ETB so it goes on the stack and prevents its destruction-life-gain ability trigger. One free kill, otherwise... If you used a flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spell on it, you would protect it from sorcery spells like Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance).
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 09:48:45 pm
This is going to be busted Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) with Thalia's Lieutenant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thalia%27s+Lieutenant) and Hanweir Garrison (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hanweir+Garrison). Thalia is going to become a 6/6 on turn 4. Thalia is going to be out of reach on a lot of removal by then.

Yup, Thalia's Lieutenant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thalia%27s+Lieutenant) is going to be a pimped up version of Managorger Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Managorger+Hydra)... I am interested to see if the Pro-players play Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) in Standard tournaments, I mean, recently, I haven't seen permanent Enchantments or Artefacts being run, unless it gives a card advantage, like an Oath of Nissa (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oath+of+Nissa) or in a Return Deck that runs off landfall triggers.

I mean the only thing I can see being an annoyance is artefact hate, and I haven't seen any yet! That, and Reflector Mage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Reflector+Mage) or Stasis Snare (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stasis+Snare), which would remove the counters, but that's only temporary.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 09:55:24 pm
Isn't some of the planeswalkers going to be in the duel decks? 

You can only get those certain types of planewalkers in those decks. They aren't supposed to be overpowering but they will be only obtainable by buying the duel decks. I am not sure but that is what I heard for the rumor :)

Yeh! That's right! They just released Ob Nixilis Reignited (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ob+Nixilis+Reignited), vs Nissa, Voice of Zendikar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Voice+of+Zendikar) and I like the new art for Nissa, but they are from the Zendikar Block, so I am not sure what will be released next. Maybe from the Innistrad Block?

They released the two planeswalkers (Chandra and Nissa) that are different from the Kaladesh Set for the Starter Deck, maybe because they didn't want to dilute the price of the amazingly expensive Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance).

Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 09:59:08 pm
Okay cool I can see how Nissa, Vital force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) could be good but I am still unsure but I agree even in the super friends deck the 2 started deck walkers aren't great I am excited to see how Vital Force and Torch of Defiance play.

I'm with you, dude! If only I could justify spending $160 to buy a playset of Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance)...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 07, 2016, 10:28:58 pm
Even though it has (4T) you would need to cast things like Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness) and Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe) in response to Noxious Gearhulk ETB so it goes on the stack and prevents its destruction-life-gain ability trigger. One free kill, otherwise... If you used a flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spell on it, you would protect it from sorcery spells like Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance).

This wouldn't even work.  Even if you removed Noxious Gearhulk as soon as it entered the battlefield the trigger would have already happened and your opponent would be able to destroy a creature and gain life if that creature is destroyed.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 11:36:09 pm
Even though it has (4T) you would need to cast things like Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness) and Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe) in response to Noxious Gearhulk ETB so it goes on the stack and prevents its destruction-life-gain ability trigger. One free kill, otherwise... If you used a flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spell on it, you would protect it from sorcery spells like Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance).

This wouldn't even work.  Even if you removed Noxious Gearhulk as soon as it entered the battlefield the trigger would have already happened and your opponent would be able to destroy a creature and gain life if that creature is destroyed.

I understand what you mean Jabilac, but it would, the instant triggers before the ETB ability. Remember when I was unsure about the ruling for Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon), the instant is cast in response to your opponent casting Noxious Gearhulk, the instant is on top of the stack, and resolves before the ETB ability, as the card enters, and then the ETB ability triggers. I had the same query when I played Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn), in a tournament and my opponent played Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) in response. Because it is an instant, it triggered before Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) (When Avacyn ETB until end of turn, creatures you control gain indestructible.)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: keagster on September 07, 2016, 11:39:16 pm
It still entered the battlefield, so the trigger still goes off, giving all your creatures indestructible after avacyn dies...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 07, 2016, 11:42:35 pm
Even though it has (4T) you would need to cast things like Grasp of Darkness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grasp+of+Darkness) and Lightning Axe (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Axe) in response to Noxious Gearhulk ETB so it goes on the stack and prevents its destruction-life-gain ability trigger. One free kill, otherwise... If you used a flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spell on it, you would protect it from sorcery spells like Collective Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Collective+Defiance).

This wouldn't even work.  Even if you removed Noxious Gearhulk as soon as it entered the battlefield the trigger would have already happened and your opponent would be able to destroy a creature and gain life if that creature is destroyed.

I understand what you mean Jabilac, but it would, the instant triggers before the ETB ability. Remember when I was unsure about the ruling for Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon), the instant is cast in response to your opponent casting Noxious Gearhulk, the instant is on top of the stack, and resolves before the ETB ability, as the card enters, and then the ETB ability triggers. I had the same query when I played Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn), in a tournament and my opponent played Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) in response. Because it is an instant, it triggered before Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) (When Avacyn ETB until end of turn, creatures you control gain indestructible.)

You can not cast Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) with Noxious Gearhulk on the stack and have Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) target Noxious Gearhulk.  Noxious Gearhulk is a spell while it is on the stack so it can only be the target of spells that target spells like Mana Leak (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Leak) or Horribly Awry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Horribly+Awry).  If you want to remove Noxious Gearhulk after it has entered the battlefield that is fine but the ETB trigger still goes off and resolves.  The trigger does not require Noxious Gearhulk to be on the battlefield to resolve.

In your case Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) ETB trigger had yet to resolve so your creatures were not indestructible until after the trigger resolves.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 11:46:28 pm
It still entered the battlefield, so the trigger still goes off, giving all your creatures indestructible after avacyn dies...

112.7a Once activated or triggered, an ability exists on the stack independently of its source.

Yes, that makes sense... okay, Jabilac, that makes it more horrible.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 11:49:53 pm
You can not cast Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) with Noxious Gearhulk on the stack and have Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) target Noxious Gearhulk.  Noxious Gearhulk is a spell while it is on the stack so it can only be the target of spells that target spells like Mana Leak (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Leak) or Horribly Awry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Horribly+Awry).  If you want to remove Noxious Gearhulk after it has entered the battlefield that is fine but the ETB trigger still goes off and resolves.  The trigger does not require Noxious Gearhulk to be on the battlefield to resolve.

In your case Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) ETB trigger had yet to resolve so your creatures were not indestructible until after the trigger resolves.

Apologies I made a mistake, the comparison with Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) was not a correct one, but you are right it does still trigger.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 07, 2016, 11:55:15 pm
To mask my ignorance of mtg's rules I will post a spoiler!

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/926/200/283/636088621298892980.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/924/200/283/636088523343757879.jpeg)

Key to the City is useful to trigger madness and make something unblockable (Incorrigible Youths (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Incorrigible+Youths)) during your upkeep you get to draw an additional card... If you wanted.
With cards like Unwinding Clock (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unwinding+Clock) and Icy Manipulator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Icy+Manipulator), presents some possibilities...

Shrewd Negotiations with something 'like' Mana Crypt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Crypt) or Bronze Bombshell (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bronze+Bombshell)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: keagster on September 07, 2016, 11:57:49 pm
Interesting, is inspired coming back?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 07, 2016, 11:59:01 pm
lol if a player in standard or draft actually has 50 life and you use Aetherflux Reservior, you deserve the win.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: keagster on September 08, 2016, 12:02:33 am
lol if a player in standard or draft actually has 50 life and you use Aetherflux Reservior, you deserve the win.
Indefinitely
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 08, 2016, 12:02:51 am
Shrewd Negotiation, lol fair deal. I give you say the 0 drop artifact equipment that gives your creature 0+3 and I'll take the avacyn
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: keagster on September 08, 2016, 12:06:58 am
Really want Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) in my Brago EDH deck...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 08, 2016, 12:08:25 am
I think red is finally going to become a staple and/or used more. Then the energy being stored and used when needed will be a thing.
The vehicle idea is cute, but nothing more.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 08, 2016, 12:11:11 am
You can not cast Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) with Noxious Gearhulk on the stack and have Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) target Noxious Gearhulk.  Noxious Gearhulk is a spell while it is on the stack so it can only be the target of spells that target spells like Mana Leak (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Leak) or Horribly Awry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Horribly+Awry).  If you want to remove Noxious Gearhulk after it has entered the battlefield that is fine but the ETB trigger still goes off and resolves.  The trigger does not require Noxious Gearhulk to be on the battlefield to resolve.

In your case Archangel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) ETB trigger had yet to resolve so your creatures were not indestructible until after the trigger resolves.

Apologies I made a mistake, the comparison with Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) was not a correct one, but you are right it does still trigger.

I misread your original post and I thought someone had Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) your ArchAngel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) before it entered the battlefield which is why I made the point I did.  After re-reading I added that your trigger had yet to resolve. :)

We accept your spoiler post as tribute  ;D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 08, 2016, 12:16:48 am
Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) and Animation Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Animation+Module) with Thalia's Lieutenent and Hanweir Garrison (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hanweir+Garrison)? C'mon now......
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 12:17:43 am

I misread your original post and I thought someone had Ultimate Price (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ultimate+Price) your ArchAngel Avacyn (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Archangel+Avacyn) before it entered the battlefield which is why I made the point I did.  After re-reading I added that your trigger had yet to resolve. :)

We accept your spoiler post as tribute  ;D

Phew! That was a close one!  :P
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 08, 2016, 12:19:49 am
Drop turn 1 Animation Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Animation+Module) then Thalia turn 2 then Garrison turn 3 and Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) turn 4

Animation Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Animation+Module) with Oath of Gideon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oath+of+Gideon) and any planeswalker
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 12:21:23 am
Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) and Animation Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Animation+Module) with Thalia's Lieutenent and Hanweir Garrison (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hanweir+Garrison)? C'mon now......

As we're discussing this you'll notice how all the new standard decks being made on deckstats are incorporating these crazy combinations. haha.

I wonder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Wonder), do you think that Thalia's Lieutenant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thalia%27s+Lieutenant) and Hanweir Garrison (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hanweir+Garrison) will increased in price in light of this?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: keagster on September 08, 2016, 12:22:19 am
Probably
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 12:23:34 am
Animation Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Animation+Module) with Oath of Gideon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Oath+of+Gideon)? and any planeswalker oooh boy

Urgh that's disgusting... you can ultimate Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) and keep her alive (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alive) in a single turn with that combination.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 08, 2016, 12:26:43 am
For the first time in several sets I'm actually preordering cards. Problem is I've not preordered all at once so the shipping fees are going to kill me. lol
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 12:35:02 am
For the first time in several sets I'm actually preordering cards. Problem is I've not preordered all at once so the shipping fees are going to kill me. lol

I know what you mean =S Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance) is going up and up in price... As well as Aetherworks Marvel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Aetherworks+Marvel)...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 05:36:44 am
Right guys, going to give Jabilac a break and post these spoilers for him.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/931/200/283/636088810848929260.png)

So basically this is an instant board sweeper, (4) mana, with an additional cost. It is a bit too expensive unless you sacrificed an artefact to trigger another ability.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/932/200/283/636088829980191111.png)

I like angels generally, but this? In my opinion, it beats Gisela, the Broken Blade (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gisela%2C+the+Broken+Blade). with Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon), it is a (5) mana with (2) fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate), which is doubled so it is instead of a 2/1 - 4/3  potentially a 6/5 with vigilance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Vigilance), life link and flying with a +1/+1 static ability...

If you didn't want counters... well, you could just bounce it with Essence Flux (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Essence+Flux), or Eldrazi Displacer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eldrazi+Displacer) to generate servo's tokens that get +1/+1 from her ability... use those tokens to transform Westvale Abbey (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Westvale+Abbey)...
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 08, 2016, 06:21:44 am
This set .... it's just ridonkulously good *drools*
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: ladof on September 08, 2016, 02:44:56 pm
Mnemosyne, don't forget (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forget) about Clues. They're artifacts you can create for basically no cost.

I understand why people are excited for this set, but I've never been a huge fan of artifacts, so this one isn't doing a whole lot for me, sadly.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 08, 2016, 04:17:01 pm
Thanks Mnemosyne for the Spoiler Posts last night :)

Got some new ones today:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/939/200/283/636089182617382176.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/940/200/283/636089185119137543.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/941/200/283/636089188400625229.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/942/200/283/636089198477189220.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/943/200/283/636089202017190997.png)
Looks like we got the entire set of Thriving Animals.  All ETB with EE and you can spend EE to put a +1/+1 counter on them.  Nothing too exciting.

We also have a few Non-English Spoilers:

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/cultivatorscaravan.jpg)

Cultivator's Caravan   3   Artifact - Vehicle   T: Add 1 mana of any color to your mana pool   Crew 3   5/5     Not terribly exciting but a 5/5 for 3cmc isn't bad either

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/wilddreams.jpg)

Wild Dreams   XXG   Sorcery   Return X target cards from your graveyard to your hand.  Exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) Wild Dreams     It can grab any card but at a 2mana for 1 card rate.  Not a great card but playable.  Probably worth it to return an ultimated Nissa, Vital Force (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nissa%2C+Vital+Force) the same turn you Ult her then +1 and laugh :)


These take us up to 90/264.

Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 08, 2016, 05:37:15 pm
Got a couple more Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/947/200/283/636089260525055620.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/946/200/283/636089254769622399.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/945/200/283/636089251235401262.png)

Aether Hub reminds me of Holdout Settlement (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Holdout+Settlement) or Unknown Shores (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unknown+Shores).  Colorless mana for Eldrazi with the option of colored mana at a price

Lost Legacy is very Infinite Obliteration (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Infinite+Obliteration) ish.  Remove a problem card from your opponents deck with the added downside of them drawing if you removed a card from their hand.

Kambal, Consul of Allocation this guy makes me wanna play BW.  He is a pretty hefty tax on non-creature spells and will be a problem for Izzet burn decks to deal with.  Maybe a new card for Modern Death and Taxes or maybe just the budget version??  That drain will take you outta burn range fast.

Edit - Misspellings
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 10:28:11 pm
Mnemosyne, don't forget (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forget) about Clues. They're artifacts you can create for basically no cost.

I understand why people are excited for this set, but I've never been a huge fan of artifacts, so this one isn't doing a whole lot for me, sadly.

YES! Clues there you go! Awesome, you could use that in combination with fleeting memories (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleeting+Memories) for mill!
What is it about artefacts that you don't find particularly interesting? I think these artefacts are slightly different from the Mirrodin Block because they are abusing Aether to create these artificial creations. I have a feeling aether revolt will be a lot like a robot revolution! Where the natural order (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Natural+Order) is a bit like, screw you guys!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 08, 2016, 10:36:22 pm
Got a couple more Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/947/200/283/636089260525055620.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/946/200/283/636089254769622399.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/126/945/200/283/636089251235401262.png)

Aether Hub reminds me of Holdout Settlement (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Holdout+Settlement) or Unknown Shores (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unknown+Shores).  Colorless mana for Eldrazi with the option of colored mana at a price

Lost Legacy is very Infinite Obliteration (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Infinite+Obliteration) ish.  Remove a problem card from your opponents deck with the added downside of them drawing if you removed a card from their hand.

Kambal, Consul of Allocation this guy makes me wanna play BW.  He is a pretty hefty tax on non-creature spells and will be a problem for Izzet burn decks to deal with.  Maybe a new card for Modern Death and Taxes or maybe just the budget version??  That drain will take you outta burn range fast.

Seriously... like Orzhov needs to get any more powerful? Kambal, Consul Allocation is insane, it gives people an incentive to play artefacts with the crew mechanic, that's why they've added it I reckon.
Lost Legacy is exactly like infinite obliteration (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Infinite+Obliteration)... I was so happy when I knew that Origins was going out of Standard, damn haha.
Aether Hub did remind me of Unknown Shores (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Unknown+Shores), though, it's slightly better because you don't have to waste mana, instead you pay with energy.  :D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: ladof on September 09, 2016, 02:09:43 am
Mnemosyne, don't forget (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forget) about Clues. They're artifacts you can create for basically no cost.

I understand why people are excited for this set, but I've never been a huge fan of artifacts, so this one isn't doing a whole lot for me, sadly.

YES! Clues there you go! Awesome, you could use that in combination with fleeting memories (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fleeting+Memories) for mill!
What is it about artefacts that you don't find particularly interesting? I think these artefacts are slightly different from the Mirrodin Block because they are abusing Aether to create these artificial creations. I have a feeling aether revolt will be a lot like a robot revolution! Where the natural order (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Natural+Order) is a bit like, screw you guys!

Honestly, they're just glorified enchantments that I can never seem to fit into my deck. I've never been able to integrate them well. I know it's mostly me, but I don't really care for them.

Kimball looks like he could be a fun EDH or Tiny Leaders commander, though.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 09, 2016, 02:59:38 am
Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) with Silverfur
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 09, 2016, 03:01:30 am
The energy is going to be fun. Store it and use when needed
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 09, 2016, 03:12:25 am
Another spoiler for this evening/morning.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/177/200/283/636089553399849509.jpeg)

This is exciting, for so many reasons... (Look at the quote as well. Heralding Nico Bolas?)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 09, 2016, 05:12:38 pm
New spoilers for today:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/183/200/283/636089778778747687.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/182/200/283/636089769798790258.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/184/200/283/636090017202923616.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/187/200/283/636090104305077561.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/188/200/283/636090108381718916.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/189/200/283/636090109677144134.png)

Got an interesting Black enchantment that gives you card Advantage at the cost of max cards in hand... Maybe another Harmless Offering (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Harmless+Offering) target?

Acrobatic Maneuver is like Cloudshift (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cloudshift)/Momentary Blink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Momentary+Blink)/Turn to Mist (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Turn+to+Mist) lets you exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) and return a creature for another ETB effect or save from removal.  This one cantrips.  I like Eerie Interlude (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eerie+Interlude) better because of multiple ETB effects but this will be a great Limited Card.

Dubious Challenge is a unique effect.  Potentially cheat out a creature but your opponent will probably get the better end of the deal.

Cloudblazer feels like an upgraded Mulldrifter (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mulldrifter) no Evoke option but Draw 2 on a flying 2/2 body added benefit of gaining some life.

Unlicensed Disintegration Typical BR spell Destroy Something and Deal damage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deal+Damage). Kinda pricy but better then Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder)

Smuggler's Copter 3/3 flyer for 2 that loots and has crew 1.  This might be one of the better vehicles so far.  T3 swinging with 3 in the air and looting.  I like this one.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 09, 2016, 05:58:28 pm
Midnight Oil is seriously begging for a Harmless Offering (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Harmless+Offering), that's the first thing that came to my mind after seeing it. That and cards that can make your opponent draw. Seems like this would fit into a mill style deck. Acrobatic Maneuver I am super thrilled to see! I love ETB effects and blink styled decks. This is going to be such a fun set to draft for prerelease!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 09, 2016, 07:16:46 pm
A few new Mid-Day Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/190/200/283/636090140103895161.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/191/200/283/636090144592812124.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/193/200/283/636090176716450828.jpeg)

Welding Sparks is a flexable damage spell.  Probably gonna hit for an average of 4-5 and even more if you are artifact centered.

Fragmentize our first real artifact destruction spell.  The low cost and wide application is nice.  4cmc or less will get quite a few of the problem Artifacts we have seen so far.

Underhanded Designs is 2 very interesting abilities in 1 card.  Neither would be worth the card alone but combined isn't too bad.  We have an Extort like effect for all artifacts that ETB under your control and we have an Executioner's Capsule (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Executioner%27s+Capsule) like effect with a different restriction.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 09, 2016, 07:34:01 pm
Midnight Oil is seriously begging for a Harmless Offering (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Harmless+Offering), that's the first thing that came to my mind after seeing it. That and cards that can make your opponent draw. Seems like this would fit into a mill style deck. Acrobatic Maneuver I am super thrilled to see! I love ETB effects and blink styled decks. This is going to be such a fun set to draft for prerelease!

I am looking forward to this Pre-Release more then I was for SOI.  I just like the new mechanics better.  I am really kind of excited for Energy Counters and I think the Vehicle and Crew mechanics are very flavorful.  A few of the vehicles are actually pretty decent cards.  Smuggler's Copter is a very nicely costed 3/3 flyer with the upside of looting.  Turns a 1/1 POS into a decent evasion beater that loots for the low cost of 2.  Shoot I can already see this card making its way into a few of my decks that use utility creatures like Blade Splicer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Blade+Splicer), Eternal Witness (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Witness), Sakura Tribe Elder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sakura-Tribe+Elder) ect. Turn those creatures into threats without potentially losing them.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 12, 2016, 04:21:59 pm
(http://1.1.1.1/bmi/media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/239/200/283/636092595632164387.png) (http://1.1.1.1/bmi/media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/241/200/283/636092636462476481.png)

Spoilers for today guys. I'm liking the look of Craftmaster Paradigm. It makes white quite powerful from the cards I've seen so far. With a simple (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Simple) 1 drop artifact this can deal 3 damage on turn 2 potentially. Also, there are a few cards that empower dwarves, especially the multicoloured R/W legendary, making a dwarves the next werewolves and vampires tribal. Equipment decks watch out, this might be what you've been waiting for.

I'm not sure about Electrostatic Pummeler. I'm combination with other artifacts, possibly,  but in standard, I doubt this will get played. It's just too expensive on mana and energy.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 12, 2016, 06:06:15 pm
New Spoilers for today:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/239/200/283/636092595632164387.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/241/200/283/636092636462476481.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/264/200/283/636092738043793268.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/247/200/283/636092708147233877.png)

We got our last Gearhulk.  Combustible Gearhulk is kind of like browbeat (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Browbeat) stuck onto a 6/6 first strike body.  Fun :)

Craftmaster Paradigm has some promise.  Starts out at 1/1 but can get +2/+1 at Beginning of the controlers Combat Step if you control 1 or more artifacts and gets First Strike if you control 3 or more.  A nicely costed efficiently aggro creature.  Keeps the pressure on while you build your board state.

Consulate Surveillance is a repeatable Pay No Heed (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pay+No+Heed) with a small restriction.

Electrostatic Pummeler is a 1/1 for 3 that can be pumped for EEE.  It gets +X/+X until end of turn where X is its power.  I am not impressed with this guy just yet but maybe after the entire set is spoiled he will look better.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 12, 2016, 08:21:56 pm
We also got to see all our new Basic Lands today.  Some of the artwork is pretty cool.  I posted a few I liked:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/250/200/283/636092714709438827.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/252/200/283/636092719554084416.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/256/200/283/636092724210942769.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/259/200/283/636092731316311765.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/261/200/283/636092734930115019.png)

Now for some new Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/272/200/283/636092788906783985.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/273/200/283/636092799699616922.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/274/200/283/636092807260505008.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/275/200/283/636092811919379320.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/276/200/283/636092814080868867.jpeg)

I see a few standouts among these C and U.

Blossoming Defense is gonna be the bane of Standard Burn and Control players for a while.  G for hexproof and +2/+2 I know I will be playing these in even green splashed decks.  Standard GB Delirium decks just got a little scarier as well.

Contraband Kingpin is a cheap blocker with lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) to discourage attacks and starts gaining you small amounts of card advantage.  Scry 1 for every artifact ETB in an artifact heavy set is going to matter.

Glint-Nest Crane hopefully replaces itself in your hand with an artifact you want to play.  With the selection of Vehicles, Artifacts, and Artifact Creatures this should hit more often then it misses.

Lawless Broker isn't the best creature but his 3 Power will help him trade and make your biggest thing a little bigger.

Prakhata Club Security definitely the worst of the spoilers here.  4cmc for a vanilla 3/4 is just kind of sad but its better then a 3/3  ;D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 12, 2016, 09:00:06 pm
Jabilac Lol, now I know why you reposted those pictures, that I 'tried' to post! They show up on my phone, strange that they didn't appear on the forum. Anyway, thanks for the Spoilers!

Blooming Defense is definitely on my card list for my Eldrazi Ramp Deck, now Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ulamog%2C+the+Ceaseless+Hunger) will be saved from Anguished Unmaking (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anguished+Unmaking)! Mwha!

The lands are lovely. It's a shame that Wotc stopped making their full art lands after Zendikar. That wasn't a gimmick at all...

Contraband Kingpin might not make it into Standard play but it is still a great card, perhaps someone can make use of skulk/ draw-discard mechanic.

Combustible Gearhulk is definitely a great card, especially in conjunction with a ramp deck running Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance).

I'm thinking that Chandra can pay for (2) of its cost, and Combustible Gearhulk will enter for (4) with the distinct possibility that my opponent will allow me to draw (3) instead of taking (3-5) damage from a high mana curved ramp deck. Definitely, a great card advantage if nothing else! Providing your opponent does not have something like Consulate Surveillance.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 12, 2016, 09:24:52 pm
Woah Blossoming Defense, why in the world would they do that? That's an amazing card for such a cheap cost. Silverfur Partisan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Silverfur+Partisan)/Zada combo utility?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 12, 2016, 09:33:32 pm
Jabilac Lol, now I know why you reposted those pictures, that I 'tried' to post! They show up on my phone, strange that they didn't appear on the forum. Anyway, thanks for the Spoilers!

Blooming Defense is definitely on my card list for my Eldrazi Ramp Deck, now Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ulamog%2C+the+Ceaseless+Hunger) will be saved from Anguished Unmaking (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anguished+Unmaking)! Mwha!

The lands are lovely. It's a shame that Wotc stopped making their full art lands after Zendikar. That wasn't a gimmick at all...

Contraband Kingpin might not make it into Standard play but it is still a great card, perhaps someone can make use of skulk/ draw-discard mechanic.

Combustible Gearhulk is definitely a great card, especially in conjunction with a ramp deck running Chandra, Torch of Defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance).

I'm thinking that Chandra can pay for (2) of its cost, and Combustible Gearhulk will enter for (4) with the distinct possibility that my opponent will allow me to draw (3) instead of taking (3-5) damage from a high mana curved ramp deck. Definitely, a great card advantage if nothing else! Providing your opponent does not have something like Consulate Surveillance.

Ya know I had the same problem when I was posting SOI spoilers.  I "posted" a planeswalker spoiler on my phone and later checked the thread only to see it was nowhere in site.  I didn't even see you had pics in there until I was in the reply section and saw broken pic links. :)

I was unaware the full art lands were a Zendikar only thing.  That makes me sad.  I love my full art lands.  Artwork is one of the under appreciated aspects of Magic imo.


Checking Mythic Spoiler I see these at the bottom and these are marked Masterpiece Series Kaladesh Inventions:

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/manacrypt.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/gauntletofpower.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/hangarbackwalker.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/verdurousgearhulkpromo.jpg)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 12, 2016, 10:19:16 pm
Quote
I was unaware the full art lands were a Zendikar only thing.  That makes me sad.  I love my full art lands.  Artwork is one of the under appreciated aspects of Magic imo.


Checking Mythic Spoiler I see these at the bottom and these are marked Masterpiece Series Kaladesh Inventions:

Yeh, it is under appreciated. Do you think these cards will be made legal in Standard, or are they just for eye candy? Because I want to eat my candy! (I have 4 Hangarback Walkers I have rarely used.)  :-\

Oh yeh! and this, sorry to spoiler steal  ;)

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/282/200/283/636092866501051328.jpeg)

I mean unless your opponent uses tokens, I am not really impressed with this, either. It's like Bone Splinters (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bone+Splinters) but for (5) mana, and assumes you want to destroy your own board state to destroy your opponent's, might as well just use Planar Outburst (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Planar+Outburst).

Now, if it said permanents! You could sacrifice artifacts, and that would be delicious. If you could use a card like Trait Doctoring (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Trait+Doctoring) on it... mmm
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 12, 2016, 10:21:04 pm
Woah Blossoming Defense, why in the world would they do that? That's an amazing card for such a cheap cost. Silverfur Partisan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Silverfur+Partisan)/Zada combo utility?

I had not thought of that, that's ridiculous... haha
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 12, 2016, 11:56:55 pm
Woah Blossoming Defense, why in the world would they do that? That's an amazing card for such a cheap cost. Silverfur Partisan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Silverfur+Partisan)/Zada combo utility?

It also put Woodcutter's Grit (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Woodcutter%27s+Grit) out of a job  :P
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 12:07:35 am
Quote
I was unaware the full art lands were a Zendikar only thing.  That makes me sad.  I love my full art lands.  Artwork is one of the under appreciated aspects of Magic imo.


Checking Mythic Spoiler I see these at the bottom and these are marked Masterpiece Series Kaladesh Inventions:

Yeh, it is under appreciated. Do you think these cards will be made legal in Standard, or are they just for eye candy? Because I want to eat my candy! (I have 4 Hangarback Walkers I have rarely used.)  :-\

Oh yeh! and this, sorry to spoiler steal  ;)

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/282/200/283/636092866501051328.jpeg)

I mean unless your opponent uses tokens, I am not really impressed with this, either. It's like Bone Splinters (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bone+Splinters) but for (5) mana, and assumes you want to destroy your own board state to destroy your opponent's, might as well just use Planar Outburst (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Planar+Outburst).

Now, if it said permanents! You could sacrifice artifacts, and that would be delicious. If you could use a card like Trait Doctoring (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Trait+Doctoring) on it... mmm

Yeah I am unimpressed with Eliminate the Competition.  It is really only going to be useful for a Fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) deck that makes tons of 1/1 servo's and then your using 5 mana and x creatures to destroy x creatures.  I would rather just cast Cataclysmic Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Cataclysmic+Gearhulk) :)

Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 12:15:19 am
Holy Toledo.  Another check on Mythic Spoiler and they have filled in quite a few of The Masterpiece Series Kaladesh Inventions:

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/cataclysmicgearhulkpromo.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/torrentialgearhulkpromo.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/noxiousgearhulkpromo.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/combustiblegearhulkpromo.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/swordoflightandshadow.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/swordoffireandice.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/swordoffeastandfamine.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/steeloverseer.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/staticorb.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/solemnsimulacrum.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/solring.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/sculptingsteel.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/moxopal.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/paintersservant.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/manavault.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/lotuspetal.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/lightninggreaves.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/scrollrack.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/ringsofbrighthearth.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/mindseye.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/crucibleofworlds.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/cloudstonecurio.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/chromemox.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/chromaticlantern.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/aethervial.jpg) (http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/championshelm.jpg)

Wow that is a ton of great artifacts.  I would guess these are not going to be Standard playable unless they are a reprint of what is available.  So the Gearhulks will be for sure but the rest might just new art prints.  They are all marked with an MPS as in MasterPiece Series so what I expect is for these to just be found inside of Kaladesh boosters but to be more collector card/Modern/Legacy playable cards and less actually Standard Playable but I could be wrong.  Oh and the art of most of these is incredible.

Edit: Misspelling
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 13, 2016, 12:23:36 am
... I would guess these are not going to be Standard playable unless they are a reprint of what is available ...

*le sigh* I would have killed to see Sol Ring (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sol+Ring) make a comeback to Standard
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 13, 2016, 12:30:46 am
Probably will be like Zendikar Expedition lands, legal for the prerelease or drafts if you open them but not standard legal otherwise.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 12:41:03 am
Probably will be like Zendikar Expedition lands, legal for the prerelease or drafts if you open them but not standard legal otherwise.

As soon as I saw Sword of Fire and Ice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sword+of+Fire+and+Ice), Sol Ring (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sol+Ring), Painter's Servant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Painter%27s+Servant), Mox Opal (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mox+Opal) and Aether Vial (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=%C3%86ther+Vial)... I knew this was DEFINITELY not going to be Standard legal... Oh man, if it were like Zendikar Expedition lands... the prices for these would be like buying a Van Gough painting at auction. Okay, that's an exaggeration.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 12:55:31 am
Mana Crypt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Crypt) has been pre-released in Kaladesh Inventions for :
194,93 € / 218.32 $

Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) has been pre-released in Kaladesh Inventions for:
74,94 € / 83.93 $
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 13, 2016, 01:19:48 am
Probably will be like Zendikar Expedition lands, legal for the prerelease or drafts if you open them but not standard legal otherwise.

I can see this happening and be cool because I enjoyed how the expedition lands played out in trying to get 1 or 2 lol or even more
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: ladof on September 13, 2016, 02:48:05 am
Mana Crypt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Mana+Crypt) has been pre-released in Kaladesh Inventions for :
194,93 € / 218.32 $

Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) has been pre-released in Kaladesh Inventions for:
74,94 € / 83.93 $

That hangarback walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) price is silly. The normal ones are ~3$ on a good day. I understand the rarity markup, but that's ridiculous.

Probably will be like Zendikar Expedition lands, legal for the prerelease or drafts if you open them but not standard legal otherwise.

I can see this happening and be cool because I enjoyed how the expedition lands played out in trying to get 1 or 2 lol or even more

Sadly, despite opening several boxes worth of the Zendikar block,I never saw an expedition. :(
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 13, 2016, 02:43:02 pm
Probably will be like Zendikar Expedition lands, legal for the prerelease or drafts if you open them but not standard legal otherwise.

I can see this happening and be cool because I enjoyed how the expedition lands played out in trying to get 1 or 2 lol or even more

Sadly, despite opening several boxes worth of the Zendikar block,I never saw an expedition. :(

Same here.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 02:46:29 pm
Yeah, expeditions were a nice addition, but a way to generate more sales. Wotc released a statement saying that they included the inventions expansion, because they wanted to make older cards accessible, whilst this is true to a certain extent, the limited supply (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Supply) makes their prices equivalent with the older cards.  :-\ I just hope this is enough to increase the supply (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Supply) of cards like Chandra, torch of defiance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Torch+of+Defiance). 
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 13, 2016, 02:57:16 pm
Can't get the image to post but...

Quote
Consul's Power 

Enchantment 
Creatures your opponents control enter the battlefield tapped.

 Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under an opponents control, you gain 1 life.

So a one drop enchantment with Imposing Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Imposing+Sovereign) ability. Might see some play in EDH stax decks.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 13, 2016, 03:11:42 pm
Well...this just forced my hand to buy a few booster boxes after prelease. I loved the Zendikar block that rolled out expeditions/full art lands, you made your money back easily if you managed to pull an expedition. I think at max a friend and I got 5 boxes of Zendikar, the initial investment was ~$45.00 a piece, ended up pulling an expedition, trading in for 2 more boxes and then another expedition, 2 more boxes. We had a lot of sealed practice events that weekend lol.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 03:47:37 pm
Can't get the image to post but...

Quote
Consul's Power 

Enchantment 
Creatures your opponents control enter the battlefield tapped.

 Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under an opponents control, you gain 1 life.

So a one drop enchantment with Imposing Sovereign (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Imposing+Sovereign) ability. Might see some play in EDH stax decks.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/322/200/283/636093239699338990.png)

I got ya :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 13, 2016, 04:01:46 pm
Thanks!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 05:25:32 pm
Got a couple more today.  1 new Planewalker:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/333/200/283/636093574214697269.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/332/200/283/636093572051286742.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/331/200/283/636093569980578277.png)

Dovin Baan has an interesting set of abilities.  His +1 can sudo-protect him.  It makes a creature's power significantly weaker and stops any activated abilities.  The effect lasts until your next turn which is nice.  -1 Draws a card and gains a little life.  Not great but inside a UW control deck this could be really nice.  -7 puts the breaks on pretty much all decks and all opponents.  Doesn't win you the game but it makes life extremely difficult for your opponents.

Bomat Courier is an interesting risk/reward card.  It can slowly build up a new hard for you while you attack but if you lose him before you can activate his ability you pretty much milled yourself.  The advantage is after your hand is played out and your ready for a refresh (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Refresh) just pay R, discard whatever you have left and put all the cards you exiled over the last few turns into your hand.

Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scrounger Yay for more graveyard recursion!  3/2 for 2 is pretty damn nice.  So nice in fact I don't even care that it can't block and after it dies you can just bring it back for the low price of 1B and exiling another creature from your graveyard (Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) anyone :) )
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 07:08:36 pm
Carrying on from Jabilac's Spoilers  ;D

First the uncommons:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/346/200/283/636093640286268014.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/334/200/283/636093595618880668.png)

Aetherborn Marauder is an interesting card, especially when considering the interaction of counters from some artefacts and creatures in this set, as well as the proliferate mechanic from modern.

Whirler Virtuoso reminds me of Thopter Engineer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Engineer) with the potential to use energy to create more, without the 'haste' ability.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 07:23:14 pm
Now the best cards in the ENTIRE set, the commons! :P

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/335/200/283/636093598476369566.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/342/200/283/636093620839401641.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/343/200/283/636093622268586062.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/344/200/283/636093636630147793.png)

Inspired Charge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inspired+Charge) is exactly the same card as the BFZ one, just with a different flavour text. Strangely enough, completely different situations.

Salivating Gremlins, just makes me salivate at the thought of bouncing artefacts like Bomat Courier, it is quite expensive for (3) but with +2/0 and trample, this baby can do some delicious damage in sealed.

Ruinous Gremlin seems like a replacement Caustic Caterpillar (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Caustic+Caterpillar), it will probably see some play in sideboards as (1) drop, until another good artefact destruction card comes along in red.

Maulfist Squad is simply ****... even though it has menace, it is (4) for a 3/1 with fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate), you can make a servo, sure but I can use Flaying Tendrils (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flaying+Tendrils) and both are gone (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Gone).
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 13, 2016, 07:26:52 pm
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/322/200/283/636093239699338990.png)

Whoa! This with Murderous Compulsion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murderous+Compulsion)! An additional Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder) set up with life gain. AH RIKE ET!! :D

Dovin Baan has an interesting set of abilities.  His +1 can sudo-protect him.  It makes a creature's power significantly weaker and stops any activated abilities.  The effect lasts until your next turn which is nice.  -1 Draws a card and gains a little life. Not great but inside a UW control deck this could be really nice.

Wait. A card draw that doesn't cost you a life, a permanent, nor forces you to discard/exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a card from your hand, deck, or graveyard. It gains you life, and this is considered "Not great"? Did I miss something here?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 07:43:22 pm
Got a couple more today.  1 new Planewalker:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/333/200/283/636093574214697269.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/331/200/283/636093569980578277.png)

Dovin Baan has an interesting set of abilities.  His +1 can sudo-protect him.  It makes a creature's power significantly weaker and stops any activated abilities.  The effect lasts until your next turn which is nice.  -1 Draws a card and gains a little life.  Not great but inside a UW control deck this could be really nice.  -7 puts the breaks on pretty much all decks and all opponents.  Doesn't win you the game but it makes life extremely difficult for your opponents.

Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scrounger Yay for more graveyard recursion!  3/2 for 2 is pretty damn nice.  So nice in fact I don't even care that it can't block and after it dies you can just bring it back for the low price of 1B and exiling another creature from your graveyard (Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) anyone :) )

I've got to say Jabilac, I disagree with you about Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scrounger. (Which is rare) It might be a 3/2 for (2) but the recursion requires you to actually have a creature card in your graveyard for you to keep bringing it back, and an extra (2) mana. I don't see this being particularly useful in standard, maybe for a Green/Black Delirium deck, but they still would want to return cards using something like Grapple with the Past (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grapple+with+the+Past), Seasons Past (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Seasons+Past), or Pulse of Murasa (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pulse+of+Murasa), perhaps. It might have its place in modern, providing you don't need the cards in your graveyard, for the dredge mechanic.

Dovin Bann is great, even though he comes in for less loyalty than his mana cost (4/3) like you said his (+1) Pseudo protects him from up to one creature, or disables your opponents creature ability, this, against Jace, Vryn's Prodigy (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Jace%2C+Vryn%27s+Prodigy) would have been a game changer.
I also like that you can use him to draw and gain life, albeit (2) and he still lives with 2 loyalty.
His ultimate is the reason why I like this so much, its like my friend said, Static Orb (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Static+Orb) it will cripple your opponent. At this stage, 2 permanents will probably be your opponents lands, (assuming he was tapped out before your turn) and this will most likely win you the game? If you have lasted this far. (9 turns in total) without any ramp. 4 turns (Dovin Bann) 5 turns (ultimate)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 07:56:16 pm

Dovin Baan has an interesting set of abilities.  His +1 can sudo-protect him.  It makes a creature's power significantly weaker and stops any activated abilities.  The effect lasts until your next turn which is nice.  -1 Draws a card and gains a little life. Not great but inside a UW control deck this could be really nice.

Wait. A card draw that doesn't cost you a life, a permanent, nor forces you to discard/exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a card from your hand, deck, or graveyard. It gains you life, and this is considered "Not great"? Did I miss something here?

I think Jabilac means that to draw a card costs him a loyalty, instead of, gaining him a loyalty. There are other cards that have the same ability but costs less, Healing Hands (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Healing+Hands). You, ideally want to find the most economical and efficient path to victory. Looking at previous planeswalkers, like Nahiri, the Harbinger (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nahiri%2C+the+Harbinger) you can see why Dovin Bann 's ability might be less of an advantage, as it delays you from using the planeswalkers ultimate ability.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 07:57:34 pm

Dovin Baan has an interesting set of abilities.  His +1 can sudo-protect him.  It makes a creature's power significantly weaker and stops any activated abilities.  The effect lasts until your next turn which is nice.  -1 Draws a card and gains a little life. Not great but inside a UW control deck this could be really nice.

Wait. A card draw that doesn't cost you a life, a permanent, nor forces you to discard/exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) a card from your hand, deck, or graveyard. It gains you life, and this is considered "Not great"? Did I miss something here?

I guess I should have elaborated a little more on why I think it is "not great".  It is a -1 ability on a 4cmc 3 loyalty planeswalker.  Dropping him in on t4 and then -1 him leaves him at 2 loyalty in a Flying heavy enviroment which makes him feel like a sorcery speed 4 mana Draw 1 card, Gain 2 Life, Prevent 2 damage card and that isn't worth 4 mana .  His -1 as an overall ability is pretty nice.  Draw a card and get a little bit of life in the right deck makes it really nice but not something you can just drop into anything running UW.  I guess my problem is his starting Loyalty in this enviroment.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 08:05:43 pm
Got your back Jabilac!  :P Not that you needed or required it.

Anyway... (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/349/200/283/636093681311356347.png)
I thought something like this might be coming, but I didn't expect it to be so sudden (Innuendo not intended)
Hexproof artefacts... Oh man, I guess hoping that nothing kills your artefacts before you drop him for (4)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 08:05:59 pm

I've got to say Jabilac, I disagree with you about Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scrounger. (Which is rare) It might be a 3/2 for (2) but the recursion requires you to actually have a creature card in your graveyard for you to keep bringing it back, and an extra (2) mana. I don't see this being particularly useful in standard, maybe for a Green/Black Delirium deck, but they still would want to return cards using something like Grapple with the Past (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Grapple+with+the+Past), Seasons Past (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Seasons+Past), or Pulse of Murasa (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pulse+of+Murasa), perhaps. It might have its place in modern, providing you don't need the cards in your graveyard, for the dredge mechanic.


I can understand where you are coming from and I respect your view but I think you nailed it on the head when you brought up Delirium decks.  This is the exact card they want to see.  2 card types on 1 card to get delirium running and then later you can resurrect him as extra pressure.  Also the combo with Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) shouldn't be ignored.  Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) is a 3/3 that you never want to see in the graveyard but now you have a way to get him back into exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) to cast him all while re-establishing board presence.  He is also a good target for discard in zombie decks another Stitchwing Skaab (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Stitchwing+Skaab) or Haunted Dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Haunted+Dead) style recursion that doesn't require more discard but exiling an already used 1/1 or something similar.

I could be wrong though I might be blinded by the 3/2 stats for 2 and the graveyard recursion ability :D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 13, 2016, 08:13:45 pm
I guess I should have elaborated a little more on why I think it is "not great".  It is a -1 ability on a 4cmc 3 loyalty planeswalker.  Dropping him in on t4 and then -1 him leaves him at 2 loyalty in a Flying heavy enviroment which makes him feel like a sorcery speed 4 mana Draw 1 card, Gain 2 Life, Prevent 2 damage card and that isn't worth 4 mana .  His -1 as an overall ability is pretty nice.  Draw a card and get a little bit of life in the right deck makes it really nice but not something you can just drop into anything running UW.  I guess my problem is his starting Loyalty in this environment.

Yep. Makes much more sense. Please forgive this pretentious n00b (me) as I recently returned to playing Magic after a decade+ haitus. I guess I am thinking too rigidly toward the Standard only environment. Although, are there not plenty of anti-flying cards, especially for Standard?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 08:22:55 pm
Everyone's still learning, especially as each set creates new mechanics. My grasp of the more, complex interactions in Mtg is tenuous at best. haha  :P
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 13, 2016, 08:35:41 pm
I have been trying to think of a use for Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) for a long time now, yet to find a good place for him to be. I wanted, so very badly, to use Soul Separator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Soul+Separator) in conjunction with him, but WOTC made the decision to make Soul Separator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Soul+Separator) cost 5 and sack itself to use its ability. That made my nerd-rage bubble over hard.

I'm in love with Padeem, Consul of Innovation. My lord...hexproof artifacts, is this really happening? Artifacts are my favorite kinds of cards, that and equipment, so I'm super excited to see more artifact geared flavor cards. I'm hoping for a few other equipment pieces in this set, I'm not super happy about Inventor's Goggles (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inventor%27s+Goggles).
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 09:38:04 pm
I have been trying to think of a use for Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) for a long time now, yet to find a good place for him to be. I wanted, so very badly, to use Soul Separator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Soul+Separator) in conjunction with him, but WOTC made the decision to make Soul Separator (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Soul+Separator) cost 5 and sack itself to use its ability. That made my nerd-rage bubble over hard.

I'm in love with Padeem, Consul of Innovation. My lord...hexproof artifacts, is this really happening? Artifacts are my favorite kinds of cards, that and equipment, so I'm super excited to see more artifact geared flavor cards. I'm hoping for a few other equipment pieces in this set, I'm not super happy about Inventor's Goggles (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inventor%27s+Goggles).

There is a combo that involves Eternal Scourge (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eternal+Scourge) , can't remember what it is atm, I will edited this when I remember.
Well, Padeem, Consul of Innovation is a (4) mana creature that can be targeted, so there is a slight problem with that.
I am not sure whether blue would work with equipment since a lot of cards that use equipment are Red/White. It could work with an Esper Control type deck, although I have no ideas for you at the moment.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 13, 2016, 09:42:28 pm
Here we go, sorry for stealing your thunder, as it were Jabilac!

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/350/200/283/636093691651485855.png)

I like this card, great potential for R/W equipment decks. (1) drop (1/2) potentially a (2/3) turn 2 for (1) like Monastery Swiftspear (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Monastery+Swiftspear)

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/351/200/283/636093739421340462.png)

The only thing about this card I like is the artwork, otherwise, it is just a (4)mana 4 damage spell. The only plus is that it can target players, as well as creatures. Good for sealed.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Frimmel on September 13, 2016, 09:57:38 pm
Flame Lash is one of the cards exclusive to the new Planeswalker decks. It is intended for sealed if you consider intro decks sealed.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/card-preview/exclusive-cards-planeswalker-decks-2016-09-13
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Orokem on September 13, 2016, 10:36:30 pm
Got your back Jabilac!  :P Not that you needed or required it.

Anyway... (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/349/200/283/636093681311356347.png)
I thought something like this might be coming, but I didn't expect it to be so sudden (Innuendo not intended)
Hexproof artefacts... Oh man, I guess hoping that nothing kills your artefacts before you drop him for (4)

Oh my god could you imagine if this guy costed 3? In modern this could be a thing:
- Turn 3 play Padeem
- Turn 4 play Madcap Experiment (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Madcap+Experiment), get Platinum Emperion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Platinum+Emperion), so you take no damage
- Turn 5 play Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai) and make another Platinum Emperion (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Platinum+Emperion), swing with 16 hexproof indestructible

Seems good
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Orokem on September 13, 2016, 10:41:53 pm
Sorry for double-posting, but actually come to think of it you could do this for even more fun:
Turn 3 Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai)
Turn 4 Padeem
Turn 5 Madcap Experiment (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Madcap+Experiment)
Turn 6 Saheeli's Artistry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli%27s+Artistry)

If Saheeli and Padeem are still alive (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Alive) you have 4 8/8 hexproof indestructibles.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 13, 2016, 10:58:37 pm
Thanks to Inventor's Apprentice I'm now a huge fan of Inventor's Goggles (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inventor%27s+Goggles), that's going to be disgusting amounts of fun for an artificer rush deck! :D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 11:43:50 pm
New spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/352/200/283/636093743330211310.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/353/200/283/636093747702325297.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/355/200/283/636093780800773786.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/356/200/283/636093785888369394.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/357/200/283/636093791333095334.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/358/200/283/636093792155597738.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/359/200/283/636093792240995314.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/360/200/283/636093793732205028.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/361/200/283/636093799651990783.png)

Ok, So the first thing I notice are that some creatures have a direct synergy with different Planeswalkers.  This is an interesting interaction and I think it maybe a first (correct me if I'm wrong).  Also we have some spells that have a decent effect and find you a specific Planeswalker.  Obviously all the cards are better when you have the respective planeswalker in your deck :)

Terrain Elemental a very standard green creature with a power higher then its cmc should allow.  Not as impressive as some but a very aggressive  creature for 2 that will almost always trade up.

Chandra's Pyrohelix is an old school Forked Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Forked+Bolt) with a new name.  Always useful and nice to have.

Tezzeret's Ambition makes me wonder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Wonder) if we are going to see a new Tezzeret Planeswalker card

Impeccable Timing is decent white removal for Standard and even more so in Limited.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 13, 2016, 11:45:19 pm
I guess I should have elaborated a little more on why I think it is "not great".  It is a -1 ability on a 4cmc 3 loyalty planeswalker.  Dropping him in on t4 and then -1 him leaves him at 2 loyalty in a Flying heavy enviroment which makes him feel like a sorcery speed 4 mana Draw 1 card, Gain 2 Life, Prevent 2 damage card and that isn't worth 4 mana .  His -1 as an overall ability is pretty nice.  Draw a card and get a little bit of life in the right deck makes it really nice but not something you can just drop into anything running UW.  I guess my problem is his starting Loyalty in this environment.

Yep. Makes much more sense. Please forgive this pretentious n00b (me) as I recently returned to playing Magic after a decade+ haitus. I guess I am thinking too rigidly toward the Standard only environment. Although, are there not plenty of anti-flying cards, especially for Standard?

No worries.  Ask questions so you understand why people think the way they do or learn something you didn't know.  If it makes you a better player in the end then its just a bonus :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 14, 2016, 12:35:42 am
From what I have heard in dark alleys and internet forums *ahem* Tezzeret Planeswalker will be in Aether Revolt. And, it is hinted that Nico Bolas is somewhat involved, hence the symbol for aether revolt looking 'like' Nico Bolas's horned face... Much like Eldritch Moon featured a symbol that hinted Emrakul, The Promised End (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Emrakul%2C+the+Promised+End).

Anyway MTG fanboys and girls spoilers!

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/366/200/283/636093842576617810.jpeg)

Skywhaler's Shot reminds me of Valorous Stance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Valorous+Stance) and you can scry.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/364/200/283/636093831415027296.jpeg)

I really like this card, the artwork, the flavour and the abilities... If there was a way to ramp the leviathan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Leviathan), it would be great card. It functions like awoken horror (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Awoken+Horror), as long as you pay its energy cost.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/365/200/283/636093840030955841.jpeg)

Interesting, but nothing special. I like the idea of flying whales, reminds me of dishonored, slightly. (I know they weren't flying, but still)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 14, 2016, 02:31:25 am
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/364/200/283/636093831415027296.jpeg)
I really like this card, the artwork, the flavour and the abilities... If there was a way to ramp the leviathan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Leviathan), it would be great card. It functions like awoken horror (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Awoken+Horror), as long as you pay its energy cost.

Blue/Green Eldritch Evolution (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Eldritch+Evolution) deck ( <-- supah jank!!) *nods*  :D   
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: robort on September 14, 2016, 03:50:06 am
A few if you have this card or have that card and then this happens. Won't be good in draft at all. The leviathan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Leviathan) is cool but won't see much play for a 7 drop. Even in draft and sealed the card is risky. Still not even close enough for artifact removal and not much for creature either. I'm sort of glad that removal isn't shown much because even with whats dropping when this set comes out. There still will be to much of it for constructed.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: WWolfe on September 14, 2016, 06:06:04 am
I'd imagine the cards that reference having specific Planeswalkers will be exclusive to the Planeswalker decks.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 14, 2016, 04:59:47 pm
Spoilers for today:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/371/200/283/636094005946634350.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/373/200/283/636094358164411809.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/374/200/283/636094359241917292.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/375/200/283/636094360461630375.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/376/200/283/636094361866338791.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/377/200/283/636094415854928573.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/378/200/283/636094417558095051.jpeg)

Metalwork Colossus is another big ole beater that's casting cost can be reduced in this case by CMC of non-creature artifacts.  I would expect this to typically be casted for between 6-8.  No form of evasion makes this guy a little less desirable as he can be chumped blocked for days but his Power can't be ignored.

Perpetual Timepiece first ability works for a few builds already established in Standard namely GB Delirium and UB Zombies.   The second one is interesting to say the least.

Prophetic Prism (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Prophetic+Prism) is a mana fixer for cheap that cantrips (draws a card) at common.  Not the best way to fix your mana but when you need a color this will make it for you.

Torch Gauntlet is just typical equipment.  Nothing exciting.

Experimental Aviator is kind of expensive for his effect and he has no power to help Crew anything.  He can block though ;)

Brazen Scourge a hasted 3/3 for 3cmc is nice.  The double red requirement will slow him down a bit accept in the inevitable RDW.

Demolish (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Demolish) has been seen in a few recent sets and is a reprint.

Now for the Non-English Spoilers:

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/creativespark.jpg)

Creative Spark   R   Sorcery   Choose target creature.  Exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) the top card of your library. You may have Creative Spark deal damage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deal+Damage) to that creature equal to the converted mana cost of the exiled card. If you don't, you may play that card until end of turn.

This is an interesting card.  Kill a creature or get card advantage.  Works well with Saheeli Rai (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Saheeli+Rai) +1 and any scry effect.

(http://mythicspoiler.com/kld/cards/disappearingact.jpg)

Disappearing Trick   1UU   Instant   As an additional cost to cast Disappearing Trick, return a permanent you control to its owners hand.   Counter Target Spell

So a 3cmc counter spell that requires UU and bouncing a creature.  If there were not so many great ETB effects this card would be terrible but as it is this can be very beneficial inside the right deck.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 14, 2016, 05:05:57 pm
From what I have heard in dark alleys and internet forums *ahem* Tezzeret Planeswalker will be in Aether Revolt. And, it is hinted that Nico Bolas is somewhat involved, hence the symbol for aether revolt looking 'like' Nico Bolas's horned face... Much like Eldritch Moon featured a symbol that hinted Emrakul, The Promised End (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Emrakul%2C+the+Promised+End).

Thanks for the info on Tezzeret and Nicol Bolas (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Nicol+Bolas).  I had to google the symbol just to see what you were talking about and Yeah I can see exactly what you mean.

(http://i.imgur.com/wpoBXSA.png)

The outer curves definitely resemble Nicol's horns and are a dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dead) give away... Can't imagine what else it could be.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 12:27:08 am
Some new Spoilers:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/380/200/283/636094427621985649.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/382/200/283/636094450978013750.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/388/200/283/636094460065809162.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/393/200/283/636094511880023454.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/394/200/283/636094517235986099.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/395/200/283/636094519340813494.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/399/200/283/636094525582569975.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/396/200/283/636094521522924139.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/397/200/283/636094524398739685.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/400/200/283/636094527450562696.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/401/200/283/636094527804524798.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/402/200/283/636094531687944571.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/404/200/283/636094677924253416.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/405/200/283/636094679494159649.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/406/200/283/636094680462221845.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/407/200/283/636094686805869708.jpeg)

Nothing to exciting in this chunk of spoilers but I will talk about a few of them in Limited context:

Refurbish is gonna be Zombify (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Zombify) for this set.  4 mana to return any artifact from your graveyard to the battlefield.  Expect this to target Gearhulks, Metalwork Colossus, Skysovereign, ect.

Foundry Inspector has a nice effect for 3cmc.  Reducing the cost of all artifacts spells by 1.  This guy will pay for his mana investment within 2 or 3 turns but expect this to be removed.  I know I will probably remove this ASAP.

Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) will be nice in a fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) deck buffing all those servo tokens and with the amount of Artifact creatures useful in almost any deck.

Aviary Mechanic is a stand out common.  A 2/2 for 2cmc is already ok for limited but this card lets you get a second ETB effect out of something nice like any of the Gearhulks or simply more tokens.  If I'm in white and have 4 or 5 strong ETB effects I am running this guy and even without them he is still a 2/2 for 2.

Now the 2 rares:

Captured by the Consulate feels like Pariah (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pariah), Pacifism (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pacifism), and Redirect (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Redirect) had a party weekend and this showed up 9 months later ;)  Stop a creature from attacking you and redirect (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Redirect) spells your opponents cast to target that creature.  It is a little slow at 4cmc but stopping a threat and stopping the first kill spell your opponent has is fairly powerful.

Oviya Pashiri, Sage Lifecrafter is a nice green 1 drop.  Her first ability isn't that strong but has synergy with a lot of stuff in this set and her second ability, in a go wide strategy, will be a nice way to quickly go big. 

That puts us at 180/264  So we still have quite a few spoilers to see in the next week or so.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 15, 2016, 12:46:23 am
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/404/200/283/636094677924253416.jpeg)

Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) will be nice in a fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) deck buffing all those servo tokens and with the amount of Artifact creatures useful in almost any deck.

I honestly expected to see this card make its return in Kaladesh, (I was hoping that Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) would also), but we will have to wait and see about that. Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) was, going to rotate out of Standard, as it is in Origins atm. It was heavily played when M15 was in Standard due to the synergy of Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker), Ensoul Artifact (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ensoul+Artifact), Darksteel Citadel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Darksteel+Citadel), Thopter Engineer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Engineer) etc. I think this will appear in a lot of Standard Artefact decks. You are right, its ability cannot be overlooked with servo and thopter generation. 
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 15, 2016, 12:56:20 am
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/388/200/283/636094460065809162.jpeg)

I mean if there weren't so many cards that could return a creature you control you their owner's hand, or exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) target creature and return it to the battlefield under its casters control, it would be good. Especially if that creature were indestructible. Imagine putting it on Ulamog, Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder) wouldn't work, because it will always be re-directed to Ulamog, and since it's indestructible, it would never die!

Creatures like Emrakul, The Promised End (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Emrakul%2C+the+Promised+End), I assume that if you enchanted it and an opponent cast an instant, targeting your creature, that instant could not be re-directed to Emrakul, because it has protection from instant spells, correct?
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 01:17:18 am
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/404/200/283/636094677924253416.jpeg)

Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) will be nice in a fabricate (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fabricate) deck buffing all those servo tokens and with the amount of Artifact creatures useful in almost any deck.

I honestly expected to see this card make its return in Kaladesh, (I was hoping that Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) would also), but we will have to wait and see about that. Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) was, going to rotate out of Standard, as it is in Origins atm. It was heavily played when M15 was in Standard due to the synergy of Hangarback Walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker), Ensoul Artifact (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ensoul+Artifact), Darksteel Citadel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Darksteel+Citadel), Thopter Engineer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Engineer) etc. I think this will appear in a lot of Standard Artefact decks. You are right, its ability cannot be overlooked with servo and thopter generation.

I was wondering myself if they were going to bring back any of the Origins Kaladesh inspired cards.  Thopter Engineer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Engineer) and Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry) were the 2 I was most curious about :)  I forgot to mention his synergy with Vehicles since when you Crew them they become an Artifact Creature until end of turn and to a lesser extent he is at 3cmc so he fits the Emerge curve.  I also think we will be seeing a lot of him around.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 15, 2016, 01:33:58 am
Jabilac, I knew a horribly good pro-player that used to play Shrapnel Blast (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Shrapnel+Blast) on HangarBack walker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Hangarback+Walker) in combination with Chief of the Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Chief+of+the+Foundry)... He also used to use Ensoul Artifact (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ensoul+Artifact) on Darksteel Citadel (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Darksteel+Citadel) and swing with it on turn (2)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 15, 2016, 07:07:05 am
Spoiler time:
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/416/200/283/636094918925379640.jpeg)(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/419/200/283/636094939085331877.png)(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/422/200/283/636094944084004058.png)

I like Insidious Will, it is a little too expensive for a counter spell. However, that being said, being about to copy a spell and choose new targets for it is awesome.

I really think energy is viable with a card like Era of Innovation! It is Low-cost at (2 mana) with a great card draw potential.
https://deckstats.net/decks/51869/567724-temur-turbine (Something with the Energy mechanic I threw together.)

Finally Marionette Master. If its mana cost was lower, it could be lethal in a sacrificial artefact deck. I doubt this will be played in Standard, but it has great synergy with Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) and flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spells.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 05:34:00 pm
Spoiler time:
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/416/200/283/636094918925379640.jpeg)(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/419/200/283/636094939085331877.png)(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/422/200/283/636094944084004058.png)

I like Insidious Will, it is a little too expensive for a counter spell. However, that being said, being about to copy a spell and choose new targets for it is awesome.

I really think energy is viable with a card like Era of Innovation! It is Low-cost at (2 mana) with a great card draw potential.
https://deckstats.net/decks/51869/567724-temur-turbine (Something with the Energy mechanic I threw together.)

Finally Marionette Master. If its mana cost was lower, it could be lethal in a sacrificial artefact deck. I doubt this will be played in Standard, but it has great synergy with Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) and flicker (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flicker) spells.

I like Era of Innovation quite a bit myself.  It falls right into that sweet spot of CMC, Effect, Effort.  At 2cmc it is cheap enough to not worry about casting it, The draw effect is a great payoff for gathering E, and the effort to make it work is almost nil.  This is one of the E cards we were waiting for :)

I like your deck synergies quite a bit.  Voltaic Brawler (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Voltaic+Brawler) and Bristling Hydra (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Bristling+Hydra) are already 2 of the best E creatures we have seen so far.  I am not seeing Woodweaver's Puzzleknot (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Woodweaver%27s+Puzzleknot) which surprises me.  I originally said Glassblower's Puzzleknot (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Glassblower%27s+Puzzleknot) was my favorite of the Puzzleknots (Era of Innovation makes it that much better) but I think Woodweaver's Puzzleknot (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Woodweaver%27s+Puzzleknot) works extremely well with the E strategy.

Also I see you are hoping for an Infinite Combo :) Panharmonicon (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Panharmonicon) + 2 Decocotion Module (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Decocotion+Module) + Whirler Virtuoso (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Whirler+Virtuoso) (among other combinations) = Infinite Thopters
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 05:41:15 pm
Got a few spoilers for today:
 
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/427/200/283/636095286781180840.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/428/200/283/636095301162663736.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/430/200/283/636095306296045826.png)

Fairgrounds Warden is a new Banisher Priest (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Banisher+Priest) but as a better blocker.

Fumigate is our new Board Wipe and it gains you 1 life for each creature destroyed.  Neat :)

Syndicate Trafficker is interesting.  3/1 on a 2cmc creature usually just makes it a decent early game aggro creature then something you keep back and block with to trade up.  This guy has the ability to become bigger and indestructible at the cost of an artifact.  Clues would be the cheapest way to feed this guy.  I'm not sold on him yet.  1 toughness is holding him back.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: KouriNick on September 15, 2016, 06:52:45 pm
All this travel for work has kept me out of the loop on spoilers. Thanks for posting everything guys! Everyday Kaladesh looks like a more exciting set :)

The cards I'm most excited about are:

Kambal, Consul of Allocation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kambal%2C+Consul+of+Allocation): This can be an amazing sideboard card against burn or control matchups (like Jeskai or Esper). I may test a couple in my Mardu Sideboard.

Contraband Kingpin (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Contraband+Kingpin): This guy is just what Modern Thopter-Sword was looking for. Now, in addition to being able to find your combo faster (that deck is full of artifacts), it can also scry with each iteration of the combo (Thopter Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Foundry) + Sword of the Meek (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sword+of+the+Meek) for those unfamiliar). The big butt and lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) are just icing on the cake, as the deck traditionaly lacked ways of defending itself pre-combo. I think Modern needs more control / psuedo-combo decks, so I'm totally on board with cards like this that make those decks better.

Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scavenger: Dredge gets another new toy... maybe... That deck is already a the critical mass of returnable stuff, and in general Dredge doesn't like to pay for it's spells.  This could be at most a 1 or 2 of, and reanimated by exiling no longer needed dredge creatures.  I'm just happy it dies to Anger of the Gods (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anger+of+the+Gods).

Dovin Baan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dovin+Baan): Quite the heated debate going on about this plainwalker. Seems like the major downside people brought up was the low loyalty and prevalence of fliers in standard. Personally, I love the -1 ability, to the point where I'd just use it every turn I could, even if it kills him. If he started with more than 3 loyalty, the -1 would probably have to be a -2, so I understand the balance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Balance) WOTC had to make. As for the downside of leaving himself open to fliers... at least he's in the two colors with the most fliers in Standard. Seems like a nice top end to a Spirits deck to me. Great way to refuel your hand and get a little extra life, and all your flying flash (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flash) spirits should be able to keep him safe.

Cathartic Reunion: I actually like this a lot. It provides the same amount of card advantage as Tormenting Voice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tormenting+Voice) for the same price, but it has the potential for double Madness, which makes this way more powerful. Tormenting Voice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tormenting+Voice) was at best a 3 drop, Draw 2 cards +lightning Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt).  This new on could be 4 drop Draw 3 cards +Double Lightning Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt). Now I know that won't happen often, but with something like Falkenwrath Gorger, this card just spews out vampires and refills your hand at the same time. I'm interested in seeing if this makes Vamps explosive enough to be competitive.

Masterpieces: I read on ChannelFireball somewhere that they'll be just like the Zendikar Expeditions (usable in limited if you pull one, but not allowed in standard otherwise). They'll also be exclusively foil and should occur in 1 of 144 packs. Fingers crossed, but like a lot of you guys, I never pulled an expedition in Zendikar block, so my hopes aren't high.

Lets hope spoilers finish strong. been great so far!
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 08:06:27 pm
All this travel for work has kept me out of the loop on spoilers. Thanks for posting everything guys! Everyday Kaladesh looks like a more exciting set :)

The cards I'm most excited about are:

Kambal, Consul of Allocation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kambal%2C+Consul+of+Allocation): This can be an amazing sideboard card against burn or control matchups (like Jeskai or Esper). I may test a couple in my Mardu Sideboard.

Contraband Kingpin (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Contraband+Kingpin): This guy is just what Modern Thopter-Sword was looking for. Now, in addition to being able to find your combo faster (that deck is full of artifacts), it can also scry with each iteration of the combo (Thopter Foundry (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Thopter+Foundry) + Sword of the Meek (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sword+of+the+Meek) for those unfamiliar). The big butt and lifelink (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lifelink) are just icing on the cake, as the deck traditionaly lacked ways of defending itself pre-combo. I think Modern needs more control / psuedo-combo decks, so I'm totally on board with cards like this that make those decks better.

Scrapheap (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scrapheap) Scavenger: Dredge gets another new toy... maybe... That deck is already a the critical mass of returnable stuff, and in general Dredge doesn't like to pay for it's spells.  This could be at most a 1 or 2 of, and reanimated by exiling no longer needed dredge creatures.  I'm just happy it dies to Anger of the Gods (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Anger+of+the+Gods).

Dovin Baan (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dovin+Baan): Quite the heated debate going on about this plainwalker. Seems like the major downside people brought up was the low loyalty and prevalence of fliers in standard. Personally, I love the -1 ability, to the point where I'd just use it every turn I could, even if it kills him. If he started with more than 3 loyalty, the -1 would probably have to be a -2, so I understand the balance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Balance) WOTC had to make. As for the downside of leaving himself open to fliers... at least he's in the two colors with the most fliers in Standard. Seems like a nice top end to a Spirits deck to me. Great way to refuel your hand and get a little extra life, and all your flying flash (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Flash) spirits should be able to keep him safe.

Cathartic Reunion: I actually like this a lot. It provides the same amount of card advantage as Tormenting Voice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tormenting+Voice) for the same price, but it has the potential for double Madness, which makes this way more powerful. Tormenting Voice (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Tormenting+Voice) was at best a 3 drop, Draw 2 cards +lightning Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt).  This new on could be 4 drop Draw 3 cards +Double Lightning Bolt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lightning+Bolt). Now I know that won't happen often, but with something like Falkenwrath Gorger, this card just spews out vampires and refills your hand at the same time. I'm interested in seeing if this makes Vamps explosive enough to be competitive.

Masterpieces: I read on ChannelFireball somewhere that they'll be just like the Zendikar Expeditions (usable in limited if you pull one, but not allowed in standard otherwise). They'll also be exclusively foil and should occur in 1 of 144 packs. Fingers crossed, but like a lot of you guys, I never pulled an expedition in Zendikar block, so my hopes aren't high.

Lets hope spoilers finish strong. been great so far!

You make a good point with Contraband Kingpin (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Contraband+Kingpin).  I didn't think about how well he meshes with Thopter Sword combo.  Great insight (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Insight)!

Catharic Reunion is a great card draw engine and should work very well in a BR vamp madness build.  They dump their hand so quickly they need all the refueling they can get.  This could also see play in graveyard decks that like Faithless Looting (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Faithless+Looting).  2 cards in the yard and the option to Dredge 3 times.. Could get out of hand.

Quote from: Mnemosyne


I mean if there weren't so many cards that could return a creature you control you their owner's hand, or exile (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Exile) target creature and return it to the battlefield under its casters control, it would be good. Especially if that creature were indestructible. Imagine putting it on Ulamog, Murder (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Murder) wouldn't work, because it will always be re-directed to Ulamog, and since it's indestructible, it would never die!

Creatures like Emrakul, The Promised End (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Emrakul%2C+the+Promised+End), I assume that if you enchanted it and an opponent cast an instant, targeting your creature, that instant could not be re-directed to Emrakul, because it has protection from instant spells, correct?

This is correct.  Emrakul can not be the target of Instants and thus can not have an Instant redirected to him.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Nickadimoose on September 15, 2016, 08:15:53 pm
Is anyone else disappointed about the sky-whale? Seriously, I want to make a sky-whale deck so bad I can taste it. We just need one good sky-whale ETB trigger...come on! Give us a sky-whale that makes sky-whale tokens so I can live my dream.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 15, 2016, 08:49:55 pm
Is anyone else disappointed about the sky-whale? Seriously, I want to make a sky-whale deck so bad I can taste it. We just need one good sky-whale ETB trigger...come on! Give us a sky-whale that makes sky-whale tokens so I can live my dream.

I just looked at the token set (http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/feature/tokens-kaladesh-2016-09-15) for this block and alas no sky-whale tokens.  We do have around 78 more chances at a good sky-whale ETB trigger though.  Maybe tap a few creatures or disable a vehicle for a turn or something like that.  It would be fun to see a Protection from Vehicles sky-whale  ;D
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 16, 2016, 05:38:02 pm
We got a lot of Spoilers today:

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/437/200/283/636095609235624412.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/439/200/283/636095652959257249.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/441/200/283/636095655561870666.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/440/200/283/636095654173916016.jpeg) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/446/200/283/636096158336578307.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/447/200/283/636096158771563568.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/448/200/283/636096159035565605.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/449/200/283/636096160392296327.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/450/200/283/636096160451891522.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/451/200/283/636096160967194535.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/452/200/283/636096161150714626.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/453/200/283/636096161409468913.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/454/200/283/636096161809640371.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/455/200/283/636096162455191460.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/456/200/283/636096162750675010.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/457/200/283/636096163106884939.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/458/200/283/636096163594863618.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/459/200/283/636096163721165600.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/460/200/283/636096164301858191.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/462/200/283/636096164708875449.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/463/200/283/636096165380192406.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/464/200/283/636096165640823053.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/465/200/283/636096165935188596.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/466/200/283/636096166433121296.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/467/200/283/636096167349600370.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/468/200/283/636096167685723050.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/469/200/283/636096167887932872.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/470/200/283/636096168187928222.png)

There are so many spoilers in this post I am only going to talk about a few of the ones I like or are interesting.

Deadlock Trap is a creature or Planeswalker control artifact.  It allows you to tap a creature or planeswalker and their activated abilities can not be activated.  With the planeswalkers we have seen already this is a great artifact to get ahold of.

Durable Handicraft is an interesting Enchantment at U.  Cheap to cast and 1 colorless mana to activated the +1/+1 counter.

Harsh Scrutiny Hand disruption is always nice.  It is a great way to see how the next few turns will play out and take whatever creature your opponent thought they were gonna cast.

Commencement of Festivities a player specific fog (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Fog) spell.  Remember its out there folks and be ready for it when your up against Green and remember its only stops Combat Damage.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 16, 2016, 06:00:49 pm
Lots of spoilers dropped while I was writing the last post.  We are getting close to the end now.

(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/471/200/283/636096168999353634.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/472/200/283/636096169338014898.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/473/200/283/636096169585847101.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/474/200/283/636096169850443820.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/475/200/283/636096170796907931.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/477/200/283/636096171021864449.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/478/200/283/636096172207315625.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/479/200/283/636096172646555540.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/481/200/283/636096172804578099.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/482/200/283/636096174351218480.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/483/200/283/636096174814228430.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/484/200/283/636096176948353563.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/485/200/283/636096177035870799.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/486/200/283/636096178351518826.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/487/200/283/636096179401554970.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/488/200/283/636096179619564196.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/489/200/283/636096179679219619.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/490/200/283/636096181285008947.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/491/200/283/636096181316905739.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/492/200/283/636096181633513349.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/494/200/283/636096184800067955.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/495/200/283/636096186687832625.png)

Subtle Strike is a pretty nifty Instant at C.  2 modes both are useful for 1B.  I like this common.

Pressure Point (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pressure+Point) is also a nice tempo play.  Tap their biggest creature (maybe a Vehicle after they crew it) and cantrip.  Another useful cheap common.

Revoke Privileges a very block specific Pacifism (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pacifism).

They have dropped more.  I think we might see the rest of the set today.  I will wait until later to post more spoilers, maybe it will be the last Spoiler post for this block :)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Jabilac on September 16, 2016, 08:44:28 pm
Ok.  The rest of the set is here:
 
(http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/496/200/283/636096188056257489.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/497/200/283/636096188679355400.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/498/200/283/636096189509055883.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/500/200/283/636096191024419149.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/501/200/283/636096191845518993.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/502/200/283/636096192597631218.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/503/200/283/636096193864701753.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/507/200/283/636096196714628256.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/505/200/283/636096196019085415.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/506/200/283/636096196341165014.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/508/200/283/636096197913605701.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/509/200/283/636096198343655674.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/510/200/283/636096200070171098.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/511/200/283/636096202041285067.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/513/200/283/636096209934544833.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/512/200/283/636096208608119147.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/514/200/283/636096212066629855.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/515/200/283/636096214799626951.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/516/200/283/636096216428642670.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/530/200/283/636096232172453769.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/517/200/283/636096218691423054.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/518/200/283/636096220519291148.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/519/200/283/636096220553993118.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/520/200/283/636096222389499502.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/521/200/283/636096222706937650.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/522/200/283/636096224817067885.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/523/200/283/636096226542644062.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/524/200/283/636096226732958466.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/525/200/283/636096228134424875.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/526/200/283/636096229496566504.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/527/200/283/636096229718566206.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/528/200/283/636096231356025224.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/529/200/283/636096231554784337.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/531/200/283/636096233605197059.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/532/200/283/636096234985604459.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/533/200/283/636096237588403267.png) (http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/avatars/thumbnails/127/534/200/283/636096238282761050.png)

Empyreal Voyager is a great card.  I am surprised it is at U.  I like this one.

Veteran Motorist makes that RW dwarves deck even better.  Another great U.

Confiscation Coup is a very powerful effect for the investment.  You can take control of any 4cmc creature or artifact without investing any more E and if you do decide to invest more E then your getting even more for your resources.

There are also quite a few creatures that deal damage (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Deal+Damage) when they are tapped.  Perfect for Crewing Vehicles.

So thats it!  The whole set.  Looks like it will be a very fun Limited enviroment and I am really interested in what people are thinking about for Constructed.  Apparently there was a mistake on Energy Token's not being printed and Wizards has issued an article (http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/energy-counter-token-2016-09-15) about it.  Also here (http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/feature/kaladesh-release-notes-2016-09-16) is the link to the release (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Release) notes for Kaladesh.
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Ujihiro on September 16, 2016, 11:17:25 pm
Gotta say, I'm loving Nature's Way (a better Rabid Bite (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Rabid+Bite)), Peema Outrider (4MC common that's a 4/4 w/trample? Don't need to convince me further lol), Take Down (1 mere green mana to wreck flyer heavy environments), Subtle Strile (I keel your weenie and make mine stronger, neener-neener), Pressure Point (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Pressure+Point) (Tap a creature AND draw a card .... Silly Keenigit, ah taunt (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Taunt) j00 a second TAIM! ;)), and Deadlock Trap.

I've said it before, I'll say it again: This set is ridonkulously good ... G  U  U  D!  8)
Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: KouriNick on September 17, 2016, 12:16:13 am
By far my favorite spoiled card is Harsh Scrutiny (1 mana to look at opposing players hand and make them discard a creature card. Scry 1). This thing isn't just Standard playable, it will likely see Modern Play. Modern has become such a creature centered format that getting to pick off anything AND get a scry on Turn 1 is massive. Especially in Black, which doesn't usually get deck manipulation like this. I can't wait to have a discard spell that I can draw late game and still cast for some value.

In Jund or Abzan, this is great alongside Dark Confidant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dark+Confidant), and gives Scavenging Ooze (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scavenging+Ooze) an additional target. Not being able to hit spells does matter, but Inquisition of Kozilek (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inquisition+of+Kozilek) can't hit Ad Nauseam (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ad+Nauseam), Scapeshift (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scapeshift), or Nahiri anyway, and at least getting a scry means this won't always be a dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dead) draw late game. Love it, and can't wait to get a playset.

Title: Re: Kaladesh New Card Discussion
Post by: Mnemosyne on September 17, 2016, 01:24:56 am
By far my favorite spoiled card is Harsh Scrutiny (1 mana to look at opposing players hand and make them discard a creature card. Scry 1). This thing isn't just Standard playable, it will likely see Modern Play. Modern has become such a creature centered format that getting to pick off anything AND get a scry on Turn 1 is massive. Especially in Black, which doesn't usually get deck manipulation like this. I can't wait to have a discard spell that I can draw late game and still cast for some value.

In Jund or Abzan, this is great alongside Dark Confidant (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dark+Confidant), and gives Scavenging Ooze (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scavenging+Ooze) an additional target. Not being able to hit spells does matter, but Inquisition of Kozilek (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Inquisition+of+Kozilek) can't hit Ad Nauseam (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Ad+Nauseam), Scapeshift (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Scapeshift), or Nahiri anyway, and at least getting a scry means this won't always be a dead (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Dead) draw late game. Love it, and can't wait to get a playset.

I agree with you on the Harsh Scrutiny, KouriNick. It is a great card, I think it will be played highly in control Black/White decks, even if it isn't a main-boarded card, it will certainly be in the sideboard.
Looking at a players hand is (Duress (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Duress)), However, instead of a non-creature spell you get to remove a potential board threat on the first turn, and if that wasn't enough you can fix your top-deck with scry.

I am kind of disappointed that Black is getting more focus than Red, I have honestly only seen Red prevalent in the combination U/R Izzet Machinegun Decks. Black has some amazing cards. Lost Legacy (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Lost+Legacy), Harsh Scrutiny, Diabolic Tutor (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Diabolic+Tutor), Demon of Dark Schemes (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Demon+of+Dark+Schemes), Noxious Gearhulk (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Noxious+Gearhulk) and Kambal, Consul of Allocation (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Kambal%2C+Consul+of+Allocation). I had hoped that Orzhov Control would be diluted after Origins lost Infinite Obliteration (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Infinite+Obliteration) and Languish (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Languish)... I like having some form of balance (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Balance).

I am also extremely disappointed that we haven't seen ANY great equipment. With cards like Sigarda's Aid (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Sigarda%27s+Aid) and Weapons Trainer (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Weapons+Trainer), we were waiting for that Boros Equipment synergy. Alas, we will have to wait for Aether Revolt...perhaps.

Red has a great pump spell, I like Built to Smash (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Smash), it is reminiscent of Titan's Strength (http://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?lng=en&card=Titan%27s+Strength) and works well with Gruul.