Deckstats Forum
English-language Forums => General Magic => Topic started by: Mnemosyne on June 07, 2021, 07:37:56 pm
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Hey all! This is a thread dedicated to the new standard expansion, if you have not guessed from the title. :)
First off, I must say, I am not a fan of Wizards of The Coast using D&D/ MTG crossovers to advertise their products.
But, as I do love Forgotten Realms, I can forgive them, a little.
I used to DM a Forgotten Realms (FR) campaign; it was all the rage, from Sembia to the Sword Coast.
(If you know!)
Anyway *coughs* I shall spoil them for you, and! I will even throw in the lore, how about that?
(I mean you did not ask for it, but you are going to get it!)
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/818/200/283/637570491901112024.png) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/827/200/283/637571770865115539.jpeg) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/825/200/283/637571766207180448.jpeg) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/823/200/283/637571761541435121.jpeg)
Okay, let us start with the deities of Faerûn, Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat). You have no doubt heard the name before. The character features in a plethora of game/book esoteric lore.
There are two types of dragon kind, in FR, chromatic and metallic. Those of Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) (chromatic) and Bahamat (metallic). Chromatic dragons being innately evil and metallic being good. As such, Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is considered to be the queen of the chromatic dragons (Blue, Red, White, Green, Black - each of her heads)
Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is a lesser deity of the FR pantheon (I’m not going to go into too much detail about pantheons because it can become somewhat complicated.) suffice to say, deities of FR are considered beyond the capabilities of even the most powerful mortal characters in FR.
Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is currently, as far as I know, residing in Avernus, the 1st of the Nine Hells of Baator and acts as the guardian of the portal between Avernus and Dis the 2nd level of Baator.
As a card I would say that she is underpowered, considerably.
A seven mana (5c) 7/7 with only flying as a key worded ability, but a powerful commander-esque ETB trigger?
Lolth next! As a planeswalker no less...
She’s considered a greater deity in FR, and is the main deity of the drow/dark elven pantheon. She rules, absolutely, from her realm, The Demonweb Pits, in the infinite layers of the Abyss (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=The+Abyss).
Denizens of the Abyss (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=The+Abyss) are considered chaotic evil, for alignment purposes, as such, Lolth and her followers are considered chaotic evil by nature (polar opposite of the Nine Hells – being Lawful Evil). One of her many titles is the Spider Queen, as shown, the literal meaning of the title is that she is known to favour spiders (you probably knew that already) and turns insolent male drow into Driders, humanoid spiders, as is her whim.
As a card I think she is underpowered.
A 5 mana planeswalker will affect the board late game, even with the ability to create two 2/1 spiders with her -3/5 to protect herself, they are far too weak with sweepers. Her static ability to gain loyalty when your creatures die, is useful, but is it enough? You want a finisher, and her emblem certainly enables that but that is a minimum of 2 turns away, assuming you have creatures die (the only way of gaining loyalty) on your opponents and your turns.
As a planeswalker? I do not personally think that is an appropriate match. As far as I am aware she is restricted to her plane on the Abyss (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=The+Abyss).
Drizzt Do’Urden (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Drizzt+Do%27Urden) is one the main characters in the FR universe, and is the protagonist of the book series by R.A Salvatore.
Drizzt is difficult to summarise here, as his lore is considerable. What I will say, is that he is a drow, that has exiled himself from his subterranean home, and has dedicated himself to good, being renowned as a hero in Faerun (Mostly known in the north - Icewind Dale).
He is usually adventuring alone, or with his companions; Catti Brie, Bruenor Battlehammer (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Bruenor+Battlehammer), Wulfgar and Regis.
He is a ranger primarily and a master of two-weapon combat. He is the chosen of a greater deity named Mielikki a patron deity of rangers, as such it makes him an immensely powerful character.
As a card I think he is underpowered, heavily. A legendary 5 mana 3/3 with a 4/1 token, ETB trigger, is not going to impact the board turn 5. Especially without haste and double strike does not protect it from instant/ sorcery removal.
Finally, for the named characters, Bruenor Battlehammer (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Bruenor+Battlehammer). One of Drizzt’s companions (as mentioned) and the king of the Dwarven realm, The Mithral Hall. I will not go into his lore, as he’s inextricably connected to Drizzt Do’Urden (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Drizzt+Do%27Urden)’s character. All I will add is that he was forced to flee The Mithral Hall as a child because a shadow dragon, Shimmergloom had lain siege to it with his duergar minions.
As a card I would say that it is quite powerful, but requires synergy with equipment. We will see what other equipment will be provided in this set! Currently we have Vorpal Sword (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Vorpal+Sword), which is powerful, but is a poor match for a boros card.
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/815/200/283/637570487845976106.png) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/816/200/283/637570489062258545.png) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/817/200/283/637570490121879970.png) (https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/822/200/283/637570501214516027.png)
I hope you have enjoyed the rundown, so far. I will add more as the set is spoilt. ;)
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
I'm not sure it's that great. Tooth and Nail (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tooth+and+Nail) lets you grab ANY two creatures AND play them for free for only two more mana, and without the color restrictions. Just getting dragons to hand doesn't sound great, unless you immediately dump your hand and Patriarch's Bidding (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Patriarch%27s+Bidding), but that's asking a lot.
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
I'm not sure it's that great. Tooth and Nail (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tooth+and+Nail) lets you grab ANY two creatures AND play them for free for only two more mana, and without the color restrictions. Just getting dragons to hand doesn't sound great, unless you immediately dump your hand and Patriarch's Bidding (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Patriarch%27s+Bidding), but that's asking a lot.
I mean, it's not like it's broken or game-winning, but getting a 7/7 flyer and tutoring 5 times for 7 mana seems pretty absurd to me.
Also it should probably be possible to set up some winning states after the tutoring (maybe involving Food Chain (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Food+Chain) or something similar?) but I'm not sure about that.
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Will Bahamut be a card? I'm very loyal to Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate series. I remember there was Draconomicon style of book from d&d 3,5. Looking at Drizzt Do'Urden (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Drizzt+Do%27Urden) I guess it's meant to boost Green-White Elves like Rhys the Redeemed (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Rhys+the+Redeemed). Most Tribal Elves are Green-Black like Tyvar Kell (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tyvar+Kell) and the tribal land Gilt Leaf Palace (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Gilt-Leaf+Palace). Of course they can be made mono-Green like a dumb Duel Deck, but it is what it is. I'm really looking forward to seeing more of Forgotten Realms, especially the Dragon side. I certainly can afford to buy Bruenor Battlehammer (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Bruenor+Battlehammer) for my Dwarven Vehicles deck. I'll be able probably to find a place for Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) (if she's not insanely expensive), but it'll be in expense of Intet, Rith or another Dragon since most of the spots are taken. Let's wait for more spoilers.
Regards,
Chavo
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Will Bahamut be a card?
Probably, though at least one bit of art involving him doesn't have him in dragon form.
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
I'm not sure it's that great. Tooth and Nail (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tooth+and+Nail) lets you grab ANY two creatures AND play them for free for only two more mana, and without the color restrictions. Just getting dragons to hand doesn't sound great, unless you immediately dump your hand and Patriarch's Bidding (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Patriarch%27s+Bidding), but that's asking a lot.
I mean, it's not like it's broken or game-winning, but getting a 7/7 flyer and tutoring 5 times for 7 mana seems pretty absurd to me.
Also it should probably be possible to set up some winning states after the tutoring (maybe involving Food Chain (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Food+Chain) or something similar?) but I'm not sure about that.
My Morophon dragons build could play easily dump all five onto the field immediately, for free, with haste. Pretty game ending.
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
You're welcome! :)
When writing this particular post, I had intended to evaluate Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) strictly for the Standard format. Whilst tutoring for 5 dragons is good, in this instance, a 5c mana card is far too difficult to mana fix to be viable for a standard deck. For seven mana you want something that can threaten (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Threaten) an end to the game, whilst being able to protect itself. For example, Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Ulamog%2C+the+Ceaseless+Hunger), a card that immediately affects the board-state. It removes two opposing permanents and has indestructible, the ability to protect itself from instants like, Murder (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Murder). It then threatens the game's end because you either deal with the card or have 10 damage dealt, potentially, to you and 20 cards exiled. Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) gives you a card advantage, this is true, but unless you can play those cards for free, which is where the true threat would lie. Unless you have the mana, you would need to wait until you could cast those dragons. You would find this card of more use in the commander format, I'm sure. :)
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Mnemnosyne, I believe Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is part of Commander line product called Draconic Rage part of the regular set. I guess she's the Commander herself. That said there probably might be more Dragons, but she's trully only for Commander. More Dragons for Modern, but maybe more for Commander as well. O-Kagachi, Vengeful Kami (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=O-Kagachi%2C+Vengeful+Kami) was fantastic in last Dragon set, so let's keep fingers crossed for more like him. Bahamut perhaps? Combining both editions? Who knows.
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I want an entire tribe based on Primus and the modrons. I want more artifacts like the Vorpal Sword (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Vorpal+Sword). I want more spells based on DnD spells like Power Word: Kill, like Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting and Prismatic Wall.
Instead I got Drizzt. Boo.
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Mnemnosyne, I believe Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is part of Commander line product called Draconic Rage part of the regular set. I guess she's the Commander herself. That said there probably might be more Dragons, but she's trully only for Commander. More Dragons for Modern, but maybe more for Commander as well. O-Kagachi, Vengeful Kami (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=O-Kagachi%2C+Vengeful+Kami) was fantastic in last Dragon set, so let's keep fingers crossed for more like him. Bahamut perhaps? Combining both editions? Who knows.
Uhhh, Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is part of the main set. Notice her collectors number?
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When writing this particular post, I had intended to evaluate Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) strictly for the Standard format.
I see! In that case, sure. I was mainly thinking about how it would perform in Commander!
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Uhhh, Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) is part of the main set. Notice her collectors number?
Oh, OK. Sure. But I think, she's truly for EDH, mostly. I find it hard to believe she'll feature at FNMs but who knows. Maybe more in Draconic Rage will follow.
Regards:
Chavo
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I am going to focus on two new spoilers today, as well as one I have previously spoilt.
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/478/200/283/637590351914201580.png)
There are a few signature spells in Forgotten Realms, Tasha's Hideous Laughter (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tasha%27s+Hideous+Laughter) is one of them, as well spells like Larloch's Minor Drain, Aganazzar's Scorcher, Melf's Acid Arrows, Otiluke's Resilient Sphere, Mestil's Acid Sheath, Bigby's (Hands) & as @Slyvester12 mentioned Abi Dalzim's Horrid Wilting.
What I am concerned about is that Tasha's Hideous Laughter (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tasha%27s+Hideous+Laughter) is in no way representative of its FR spell counterpart. Tasha's is a second level spell out of a possible nine spell levels, excluding epic levels. Which means, that the spell is of a low level, and in no way, should it be considered a rare card. Its effect also differs; Tasha's is an enchantment spell that makes a creature lose its' action for the duration of the spell. If I was to transcribe that on a card I would have the property do something in the vicinity of 1) Sorcery - Until end of turn creatures your opponent controls cannot block attacking creatures you control. 2) Flash (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Flash) enchantment - for as long as this enchantment remains on the battlefield enchanted creature cannot block. I am not even certain the card designers have even played D&D let alone Forgotten Realms. But... We will see if future cards will similar.
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/281/816/200/283/637570489062258545.png)
Power Word Kill (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Power+Word+Kill) is a great FR spell and it actually does in essence what the spell does as a MTG card. However, it is a spell of a high level, level nine of a possible nine, which would make it one of the most powerful spells and deserving of a rare card. Something on the same level as Vraska's Contempt (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Vraska%27s+Contempt), however, without the exile (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Exile) ability. Whilst PWK is a powerful spell there are restrictions, and creatures that are immune to death spells 'demons' being one of them, well the card text is accurate. I would, however, would have liked if the card did more, as I feel it is not in keeping with the spell's FR counterpart.
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/477/200/283/637590349390452711.png)
Flumph (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Flumph)! I actually had to read up on the lore of this card, because it is not a creature I have encountered in FR. And whilst the artwork is on par with what a Flumph (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Flumph) actually is, I do not agree with the card's colour nor its description text.
Let me explain!
A Flumph (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Flumph) is a low challenge rating creature somewhere in the region of level 1-3 (definitely not a powerful creature) it is also a semi-sentient psionic life-form, I would say their closest MTG analogue would be a fungus? A creature that feeds on residual psionic energy from other psionic beings, like Aboleth and Illithid (Mind Flayers) and so are found living near these creature's lairs. They often accidentally 'absorb (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Absorb)' bad thoughts (evil knowledge) from these creatures via circumstance and absolutely 'hate' it. This is because they are of a good alignment, so when an opportunity (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Opportunity) presents itself, they offload their knowledge onto good aligned beings that cross their path, not because they necessarily consider it a gift but because they don't want to hold onto it. Something akin to a symbiotic exchange that is partially beneficial to the adventurer to warn them that they are in danger and yet beneficial to the other organism because it is a way of ridding themselves of this unwanted knowledge.
Anyway, I hope you liked the information! More to come, I imagine.
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Mnemnosyne, respect. I didn't know you were such a Forgotten Realms D&D lady-buff. I remember Power Word Kill (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Power+Word+Kill), due to my experiences with Baldur's Gate series and Icewind Dale included, although it's not commonly achieved spell, and I only like to Arteplid in 4-party Half Elven machinery that just does good almost any impossible way, but no Power Word Kill (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Power+Word+Kill) at found or bought scrolls around Kuldahar for my Mage/Thief let alone the counterpartish Bard. I'm amazed back to thing, that you know what is Flumph (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Flumph) and to such degree know the lore of this fantastic campaign setting and fantasy world it is.
Regards: Chavo
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Looks like a decent amount of spoilers today (so far, only 11AM here).
Was kind of hoping if they did a named and/or legendary beholder it would at least have an ability for each colour plus colourless to represent their various eye beams.
Flavourwise I like what I see. Various cards with multiple choices, rolling a d20 to see what you get, etc.
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That was very interesting to read, thanks!
I don't know anything about Forgotten Realms, but I can say that Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat)'s ability looks crazy strong to me. Tutoring for the 5 best Dragons in your deck is incredibly strong (tutor 5 times for only 7 mana?!), and can be used to set up game-winning scenarios.
I'm not sure it's that great. Tooth and Nail (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tooth+and+Nail) lets you grab ANY two creatures AND play them for free for only two more mana, and without the color restrictions. Just getting dragons to hand doesn't sound great, unless you immediately dump your hand and Patriarch's Bidding (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Patriarch%27s+Bidding), but that's asking a lot.
I mean, it's not like it's broken or game-winning, but getting a 7/7 flyer and tutoring 5 times for 7 mana seems pretty absurd to me.
Also it should probably be possible to set up some winning states after the tutoring (maybe involving Food Chain (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Food+Chain) or something similar?) but I'm not sure about that.
Have a leyline of anticipation (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Leyline+of+Anticipation) or vedalken orrery (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Vedalken+Orrery) then cast patriarchs bidding and while it's on the stack cast one with nothing (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=One+with+Nothing) not super broken but pretty flashy if you're into that kind of thing.
Ps no pun intended
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Looks like there's enough support for dungeons that one could build an EDH deck around it (a fairly janky one but still). Not a big fan of the dungeons personally but I really like the D20 throw though. I know this set is probably fun for D&D players but feels pretty lukewarm thus far, which on the other hand isn't a bad thing - I don't need to be buying cards all the time :P
I'm putting my hope in the precons, especially hoping the Esper one to be great!
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I'm putting my hope in the precons, especially hoping the Esper one to be great!
There's an Esper precon...? Oh dear. Gotta get that.
On another note: I really like the Cradle Elf, Artifact Pod and the new Not-Me Untapper. This set feels good. I don't like the D&D aspect of it either but I don't really care; it's nice to see some crossovers every now and then.
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Gotta admit, I wasn't very excited for the idea of this set but having seen the spoilers I'm a little intrigued.
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Gotta admit, I wasn't very excited for the idea of this set but having seen the spoilers I'm a little intrigued.
New to the forums here, but long time MtG player; I feel the same way. TBH I haven't seen much in the way of the upcoming cards outside of this thread. Lots of top notch info and analysis here.
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Apologies for not spoiling these cards sooner!
I wanted to wait a little and see what MTG were trying to do with the set and I've figured it out, mostly. But, before I reveal my thoughts I will post spoilers of cards that do not have any specific lore relating to FR.
Lands
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/670/200/283/637607183533432622.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/542/200/283/637605765001937543.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/701/200/283/637607327349521284.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/671/200/283/637607184356026267.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/533/200/283/637605674317866785.jpeg)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/976/200/283/637611955227494414.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/977/200/283/637611959622909947.png)
Artefacts
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/810/200/283/637608354389905058.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/837/200/283/637608551325942806.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/758/200/283/637607680331538928.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/852/200/283/637608577814806887.png)
Multicoloured
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/818/200/283/637608468468476502.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/664/200/283/637607175357079759.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/973/200/283/637611952961110958.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/870/200/283/637609059953573175.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/900/200/283/637610816074109823.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/974/200/283/637611953381652332.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/765/200/283/637607684729280586.png)
White
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/953/200/283/637611934663025363.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/955/200/283/637611935263879319.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/828/200/283/637608545000875123.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/995/200/283/637612739183075390.png)
Blue
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/832/200/283/637608548931066866.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/641/200/283/637607152328112335.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/957/200/283/637611938287758794.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/902/200/283/637610916966245329.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/612/200/283/637606703894332113.png)
Black
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/963/200/283/637611942353220215.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/649/200/283/637607158789492861.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/650/200/283/637607159941072467.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/965/200/283/637611943024006169.png)
Red
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/652/200/283/637607161859258129.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/966/200/283/637611946815068749.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/967/200/283/637611947527505443.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/636/200/283/637606879890274227.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/535/200/283/637605693639615452.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/656/200/283/637607164380862535.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/815/200/283/637608409945361635.png)
Green
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/547/200/283/637606065198529771.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/703/200/283/637607330091944036.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/896/200/283/637610150393626142.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/659/200/283/637607167868749121.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/970/200/283/637611950152289520.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/663/200/283/637607171134932137.png)
These are the non-specific Forgotten Realms cards that have been released so far! (Rare cards, anyway)
More to come!
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Thank you Mnemosyne.
I am curious about the lore of Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen). Is there a connection between his lore and his planeswalker card mechanics? What's up with the Dog Illusion; is there a special significance there?
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Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen) has several signature spells, one of which is Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Faithful Hound. The others include his Sword, Private Sanctum, and Magnificent Mansion.
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Now that the full spoiler is out, how does everyone feel about this set? I thought it was strange that some cards like Dragon Turtle (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Dragon+Turtle) and Wight (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Wight) had to give italicized writing to point out what the flavor they were aiming for was.
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The italicized writing is just calling the ability by its D&D name. Creatures in D&D often have at least one special ability that's named, like Life Drain.
By writing it the way they did, the cards resemble a monster stat block from a D&D rulebook like the Monster Manual.
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Now that the full spoiler is out, how does everyone feel about this set? I thought it was strange that some cards like Dragon Turtle (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Dragon+Turtle) and Wight (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Wight) had to give italicized writing to point out what the flavor they were aiming for was.
I was a little put off by the italicized abilities. I know that they were meant to reference specific D&D abilities/attacks/spells/etc., but it felt weird since that's not how mtg typically represents things like that. It would make sense for an instant to be called "Drag Below" and then have the Dragon Turtle (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Dragon+Turtle) text, but when it's italicized in the text box, my mind reads it as a set mechanic that will appear on multiple cards, not a unique named one-off. Same for "Life Drain". Magic has a history of adapting references and abilities from other things to its own mechanics, and it's usually a lot more elegant/confident than this. (And if MTG ever did gain a mechanic called "Life Drain", it wouldn't be this.) I understand the reference, but I don't want my mtg product to be written using the conventions of a different game. I have a Monster Manual I can look at for that if I need.
I also feel some dissonance between this set and Zendikar Rising. My understanding was Zendikar was already their D&D homage plane, using a lot of the tropes and terminology, even down to the party mechanic. To then turn around and release an actual D&D crossover feels like whiplash, especially since it didn't even use the party . When you do an homage and then a literal crossover, it kind of throws your homage under the bus. Are we going to follow Strixhaven with an actually Harry Potter crossover? I already felt the party mechanic to be a forced reference (what, Zendikari don't let barbarians, rangers, and paladins into their adventuring parties?), and now it feels like a bad imitation of what they really wanted. They even named an ability "Form a Party" on You Meet in a Tavern (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=You+Meet+in+a+Tavern) that does not relate to parties in a mechanical sense. I don't think they would call an ability "Draw a card" or "Untap" without it doing those things because its confusing, and doing it with party in the D&D set just after party was introduced as a D&D reference seems on the same level of laziness as the named abilities. The set just feels really slapped together, with all the effort going into making D&D references and very little into adapting it to the MTG rules environment.
Is it petty of me to complain about planeswalkers in Faerun? Since that setting already has planar travel and it is emphatically NOT planeswalking? And gods are a creature type, so... what's with that?
This feels like not only a bunch of whining, but not even original whining. Complaining about this game not hitting the flavor right or printing a set that doesn't match expectations or even doing something that will RUIN MAGIC FOREVER(tm) is part of the package. You take a break for a little while and come back later to see all the new cards you missed. I just feel like they are playing a dangerous game with brand (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Brand) integrity, and I'm becoming frustrated out of engaging. I guess it's just my turn now.
I like D&D. I've been playing it and reading FG books since the 90s. I also like MTG, and have been playing it for almost exactly as long. I'm already buying products from both lines. I wish (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Wish) Hasbro would just let me keep paying them for two games instead of compressing me into a generic consumer bloc of "plays that wizards and dragons fantasy crap" so they can market each in the other.
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Thank you Mnemosyne.
I am curious about the lore of Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen). Is there a connection between his lore and his planeswalker card mechanics? What's up with the Dog Illusion; is there a special significance there?
I think that @Slyvester has mentioned the main parts. I was going to go into his lore briefly (takes a while to write these things)
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/282/919/637611051266455135.png)
Let us have a look at him in a little more detail. Funnily enough, Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen) is not originally a Forgotten Realms character, even though many of his signature spells feature in the FR campaign. He is from a world known as Greyhawk, along with Ebberon, are other universes set within the sphere of Dungeons and Dragons.
The parts MTG have right, is that he is considered a planeswalker and his spells happen to be within the blue colour wheel.
He and Elminster (a FR main character that doesn't feature in this set) have met before on 'Earth' = Ed Greenwood's (the creator of FR's) living room. Apparently, he has a residence in Waterdeep 'The City of Splendours' in Forgotten Realms and is one of the circle of eight, eight powerful creators of spells.
A shame, given that MTG has decided not to include any of these signature spells, a part from a spell called Mordenkainen's Polymorph (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen%27s+Polymorph), which would be considered an enchantment; odd, considering that he is known for conjuration spells... which, fortunately, is his second planeswalker activated ability = -2 create blue dog illusion = Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Faithful Hound.
He is also known for these spells
Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Magnificent Mansion
Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Private Sanctum
Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Phantom Guardian/ Phantom Defender
Mordenkainen (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Mordenkainen)'s Disjunction
His other planeswalker abilities seem odd, considering his wizard focus. He is an awesomely powerful spellcaster with a huge repertoire of spells, ones which focus on defence and illusion, which would have been more interesting to see as planeswalker abilities, instead of the generic MTG abilties he has currently.
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So what does everyone think about the cards spoiled from the Commander decks? The bant voltron deck seems to have some good new cards in it and it comes along at a perfect time for me. I've been considering rebuilding my Daxos of Meletis (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Daxos+of+Meletis) voltron deck that I have such fond memories of.
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I might get the Prosper, Tome-Bound (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Prosper%2C%20Tome-Bound&set=AFC&collector_number=2&language_code=en) precon. Share the Spoils has my attention as a fun card and that precon also has a few good filler cards like Disrupt Decorum (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Disrupt+Decorum), Talisman of Indulgence (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Talisman+of+Indulgence), and Fellwar Stone (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Fellwar+Stone).
(http://mythicspoiler.com/dnd/cards/sharethespoils.jpg)
The Galea, Kindler of Hope (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Galea%2C%20Kindler%20of%20Hope&set=AFC&collector_number=1&language_code=en) precon has a Heroic Intervention (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Heroic+Intervention) and a Utopia Sprawl (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Utopia+Sprawl), so there is some good stuff there.
The only other card that has my attention is Dragonborn Champion. That could become a staple in Gruul stompy decks. They usually lack card draw. Dragonborn Champion will give one card per creature that deals 5 damage.
(http://mythicspoiler.com/dnd/cards/dragonbornchampion.jpg)
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Yeah, I'm looking at Galea for a potential elf/enchantments deck. I'd finally have a home for the Serra's Sanctum (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Serra%27s+Sanctum) I've been sitting on for years.
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Apologies for not spoiling these cards sooner!
I wanted to wait a little and see what MTG were trying to do with the set and I've figured it out, mostly. But, before I reveal my thoughts I will post spoilers of cards that do not have any specific lore relating to FR.
Lands
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/670/200/283/637607183533432622.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/542/200/283/637605765001937543.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/701/200/283/637607327349521284.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/671/200/283/637607184356026267.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/533/200/283/637605674317866785.jpeg)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/976/200/283/637611955227494414.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/977/200/283/637611959622909947.png)
Artefacts
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/810/200/283/637608354389905058.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/837/200/283/637608551325942806.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/758/200/283/637607680331538928.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/852/200/283/637608577814806887.png)
Multicoloured
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/818/200/283/637608468468476502.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/664/200/283/637607175357079759.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/973/200/283/637611952961110958.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/870/200/283/637609059953573175.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/900/200/283/637610816074109823.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/974/200/283/637611953381652332.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/765/200/283/637607684729280586.png)
White
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/953/200/283/637611934663025363.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/955/200/283/637611935263879319.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/828/200/283/637608545000875123.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/995/200/283/637612739183075390.png)
Blue
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/832/200/283/637608548931066866.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/641/200/283/637607152328112335.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/957/200/283/637611938287758794.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/902/200/283/637610916966245329.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/612/200/283/637606703894332113.png)
Black
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/963/200/283/637611942353220215.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/649/200/283/637607158789492861.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/650/200/283/637607159941072467.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/965/200/283/637611943024006169.png)
Red
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/652/200/283/637607161859258129.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/966/200/283/637611946815068749.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/967/200/283/637611947527505443.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/636/200/283/637606879890274227.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/535/200/283/637605693639615452.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/656/200/283/637607164380862535.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/815/200/283/637608409945361635.png)
Green
(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/547/200/283/637606065198529771.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/703/200/283/637607330091944036.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/896/200/283/637610150393626142.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/659/200/283/637607167868749121.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/970/200/283/637611950152289520.png)(https://media.mtgsalvation.com/avatars/thumbnails/282/663/200/283/637607171134932137.png)
These are the non-specific Forgotten Realms cards that have been released so far! (Rare cards, anyway)
More to come!
Amazing post, and thank you for taking the time to share these; I'm now looking forward to this set much more than I was before.
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These are two very different games, so I wouldn't necessarily expect things like the rarity (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Rarity) or mana value to reflect their D&D counterparts. PW Kill is just an iconic kill spell, so mission accomplished. Agree about Tasha's, though, it's just a lame mill-esq spell that has nothing to do with the original. Perhaps it's hideous because milling out is such a hideous rule, and the devs are laughing at us because it's so terrible? :-) Sygergy with the cool Ashiod, though, I guess.
Tiamat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tiamat) actually has a nice, if kinda boring, play pattern as a commander. Just pack mostly ramp and a few game-ending dragon bombs, ramp up to her then her ETB tutors for a handful of stuff you can also now afford to play. Not exactly competitive but it feels like a fairly easy deck to build, and functional.
I played against a dungeons EDH deck the other day. It wasn't super powerful but was quite cool, and I don't think the guy had exactly tweaked it yet.
On the whole I like this set, though the lack of Party is a massive bummer. They finally go and print a good mechanic, but then we have a perfect opportunity (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Opportunity) to see more of it, and what do we get? Dice rolls? They really missed a trick here.
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So looking over all the spoilers, there's definitely some equipments and auras that can slot into the Daxos of Meletis (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Daxos+of+Meletis) deck I'm probably going to piece back together. What has me most excited though is probably Death Tyrant, that looks like some spice for Sidisi.
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Scaled Herbalist (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Scaled+Herbalist) and Werewolf Pack Leader (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Werewolf+Pack+Leader) are two green cards I look forward to experimenting with in Modern.