Deckstats Forum
English-language Forums => General Magic => Topic started by: Morganator 2.0 on March 16, 2023, 10:22:31 pm
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This is getting discussed everywhere else already, so I'm going to start it here.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/formats
In short, Oathbreaker has been added to the MtG formats page. This has caused a resurgence in people checking out what this format is about, and making decks. For those who don't know, it's a commander variant that uses 60 card decks, is multiplayer, 20 life, and you have 2 cards in your command zone. The first is your oathbreaker, that functions exactly like a commander except it's a planeswalker instead of a legendary creature. The second is your signature spell; an instant/sorcery that falls within your commander's oathbreaker's colour identity. You can only cast the signature spell if your oathbreaker is on the battlefield, and it has it's separate commander tax of 2 mana per cast.
There are a few other rules to iron out the details of a signature spell and the format has its own banlist (https://oathbreakermtg.org/banned-list/).
So, does anyone else still have Oathbreaker decks? Anyone going to build some new ones? And what do you think of the format as a whole?
I have two older decks that haven't been updated in a while. The first (and my favourite) is Xenagos, the Reveler (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Xenagos%2C+the+Reveler) + Genesis Wave (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Genesis+Wave). It does exactly what you expect; play creatures, ramp hard, cast a massive Genesis Wave (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Genesis+Wave), attack to win. I make a lot of Gruul decks, but this is the only time I've truly done gruul stompy.
My second is Jace, Wielder of Mysteries (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Jace%2C+Wielder+of+Mysteries) + Paradigm Shift (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Paradigm+Shift). This one is much faster, more consistent, and more resilient than most other decks. It works by first exiling it's own graveyard (if necessary) and then casting Paradigm Shift (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Paradigm+Shift). You win off Jace with an empty library. And because it's mono-blue, most of the rest of the deck is just protection spells.
I'm currently working on a Tyvar, Jubilant Brawler (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tyvar%2C+Jubilant+Brawler) + Glimpse of Nature (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Glimpse+of+Nature) storm deck. We'll see how it turns out.
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I played a bit of Oathbreaker back in the day and it was fun.
I had an Angrath, Captain of Chaos (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Angrath%2C+Captain+of+Chaos) // Crash Through (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Crash+Through) deck that was just a super aggressive Rat Colony (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Rat+Colony) deck.
I had a Kiora, Behemoth Beckoner (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Kiora%2C+Behemoth+Beckoner) // Treasure Hunt (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Treasure+Hunt) deck that was 56 lands, an Ayula's Influence (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Ayula%27s+Influence) and a Spell book. It was really funny the first two or three times.
Haven't looked at it or played it for a while, but I can see my playgroup giving it another look. It felt like it got solved pretty quickly so people lost interest, but our playgroup self moderate well so shouldn't be a massive issue.
I like the idea of picking a signature spell for flavour rather than gameplay, so if we got back into it I can see me doing something like Tevesh Szat, Doom of Fools (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Tevesh+Szat%2C+Doom+of+Fools) and Szat's Will (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Szat%27s+Will).
Or something fun and dumb like Comet, Stellar Pup (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Comet%2C+Stellar+Pup) and a blink (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Blink) effect so you can just roll that dice over and over.
There's probably some cool shit you can do with Jared too now there is a 5 colour PW.
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It felt like it got solved pretty quickly so people lost interest
Yeah, that happened. The advantage of having two cards in the command zone means you can brew very consistent synergies and combos. I know the Jace deck I played was one of those. Chandra, Acolyte of Flame (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Chandra%2C+Acolyte+of+Flame) + Divergent Transformations (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Divergent+Transformations) is another deck that has a very consistent and quick win.
Unfortunately, Oathbreaker's design does not favour disruptive decks to the same degree. I've been meaning to try and brew a deck that can mess with these early wins. I have a friend that made a hard-control deck with Teferi, Time Raveler (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Teferi%2C+Time+Raveler) + Finale of Glory (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Finale+of+Glory). It's still difficult to control 3 other decks at once, but this one did pretty well.
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It’s intriguing, but the signature spell always just felt like too much of a diversion from regular Magic to me. Like… March of the Multitudes (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=March+of+the+Multitudes)? Or just Demonic Tutor (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Demonic+Tutor).
I mean, Sol Ring (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Sol+Ring) is on the banlist, so +1 from me for that (#bansolring) but, otherwise, I’m not so sure.
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I have one combo Oathbreaker deck with Lukka, Coppercoat outcast (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Lukka%2C+Coppercoat+Outcast) and seething song (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Seething+Song). It plays only 1 drops and blightsteel colossus (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Blightsteel+Colossus). I’ve played on Untap.in for several years and I’ve never seen a Oathbreaker lobby ever. Tbh I doubt I will ever seen one
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It felt like it got solved pretty quickly so people lost interest
Yeah, that happened. The advantage of having two cards in the command zone means you can brew very consistent synergies and combos.
Yeah. Like, Leovold is banned in Commander, but Narset, Parter of Veils (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Narset%2C+Parter+of+Veils)+Windfall (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Windfall) is ok in Oathbreaker, lol.
Unless they start printing format-spefici products like they did with commander, I think this well get boring very fast. The point is: do we really want more format-specific products?
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Unless they start printing format-spefici products like they did with commander, I think this well get boring very fast. The point is: do we really want more format-specific products?
I don't think there needs to be format-specific products for something to be successful. Sometimes you can have a product tailored for a format and it still fails (like the brawl decks). Oathbreaker could benefit from planeswalkers in Abzan, Naya, and Sultai colours. No specific product needed.
What's really needed is better monitoring of problematic decks and playstyles. As it stands, combo is even more powerful in Oathbreaker than in commander, and it's so easy to pull off. I've been experimenting with trying to build different types of disruptive decks, but they just can't get on combo's level.
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I don't think there needs to be format-specific products for something to be successful. Sometimes you can have a product tailored for a format and it still fails (like the brawl decks). Oathbreaker could benefit from planeswalkers in Abzan, Naya, and Sultai colours. No specific product needed.
What's really needed is better monitoring of problematic decks and playstyles. As it stands, combo is even more powerful in Oathbreaker than in commander, and it's so easy to pull off. I've been experimenting with trying to build different types of disruptive decks, but they just can't get on combo's level.
I'm all for this.
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When you can have a tutor “in the command zone”, it feels like it becomes very easy just to go straight to a cEDH-style deck very quickly. There are several ways you can put a pretty fast clock on the table such that if you’re not interacted with (and nobody else wins faster), you win. I’m amazed that e.g. Demonic Tutor (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Demonic+Tutor) isn’t banned (particularly since, unlike with Sidisi, you’re not limited to monoblack).
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Lutri is also legal, so U/R/x decks get a free companion.
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If per chance it actually does make a come back. It's just going to be really fast games especially with newer cards that came out since the inception of oath breaker. 2 cards come into mind such as Fierce Guardianship (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Fierce+Guardianship) and Deflecting Swat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Deflecting+Swat). Free spells to use without much downside even with commander tax. 2 Fierce Guardianship (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Fierce+Guardianship) or 2 Deflecting Swat (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Deflecting+Swat) for just the simple price of 2 generic commander tax mana. Plus the ban list hasn't been updated (a.k.a Jeweled Lotus (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Jeweled+Lotus) for instance). It will be a solved broken format just like tiny leaders was and will falter (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Falter) to the way side.
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Well, I'm not sure if it's "solved" exactly, but certainly fast and linear. The ability to do something like Lukka -> Blightsteel or Demonic Tutor (https://cards.deckstats.net/magiccard.php?utf8=1&lng=en&card=Demonic+Tutor) -> Thoracle combo from the command zone means that, whilst you might not exactly be guaranteed to win, you've got a pretty short clock on the game regardless of the hand you draw. It kinda feels like you either (a) go first and do the same thing, but faster, or (b) pack your deck with planeswalker removal and cheap counterspells and mulligan like crazy... then do the same thing, just a little bit later. It just feels... very tiresome? And very cEDH-like, except with even more c. Almost like, to EDH, what one of these old formats with all the busted cards is to Standard.