[Legacy] Joraga Elves

[Soren841]

"you keep this place alive " tyty 😬

You also lose against blue
I changed to 3 Gaea's cradle because in the burn matchup you will doubtless have less creatures in play.
12 1 drops is too much. Maybe it won't seem like it but trust me in reality you'll be stuck drawing a ton of them and wishing for something good. I have experienced that with half the amount of elves
I added utopia sprawl to help decrease your dependency on the 1/1 dorks.
The other way you could do what I did is Archetype of Endurance, but against burn I don't know if casting that is realistic, as you'll probably only have a little bit of Ramp.
And it's not dead in 5/6 matchups. It's dead in 5/32 matchups, remember multicolored. It stops aggro which is a top deck ATM.

[Soren841]

You could use steely resolve instead
Props to Snook-Zulu for the suggestion

[Borg]

You also lose against blue

That seems like a very generic statement.
What exactly is your definition of "blue" ?

I changed to 3 Gaea's cradle because in the burn matchup you will doubtless have less creatures in play.

But you'll play far more games against decks that don't run burn - a 5 to 1 ratio.

And it's not dead in 5/6 matchups. It's dead in 5/32 matchups, remember multicolored.

So, you're saying that in 27 out of 32 matchups there's red in it ? Get real
Seriously, there are 6 colors ( 5 colors + colorless + any kind of multicolour combinations )
Any way you turn this ... there will always be 5 times more combinations without red than with red.
You can play W/G/U , B/U/G/W ... what have you.
Point is : red is 1/6th of the possible combinations, therefore, on average and assuming that all combinations see an equal amount of play, you'll meet Red in 1 of every six match ups on average.

12 1 drops is too much. Maybe it won't seem like it but trust me in reality you'll be stuck drawing a ton of them and wishing for something good.

Drawing "something good", that's what this is about, indeed.
Well, let's say I play a W/U or a G/B opponent.
What do you rather draw : a one mana elf that comes into play as a 5/5 creature ( Archdruid, Warcaller etc ) or an Absolute Law. That's a no brainer is it ?

But tell you what. I'll try it out.
I'll replace the Joraga Treespeakers with Utopia Sprawl
and replace 3 Fyndhorn Elves with Steely Resolve. ( Props snook-zulu )
Earthquake could still be a problem.
I'll see how the deck performs.

[Soren841]

There's really only a couple of functional mono blue strategies and they all screw green
Shroud would benefit against blue black and white as well, its better to reduce your dependency on creature ramp because it's much easier for them to tap it bounce it or kill it than with enchantments

[Soren841]

And in my deck flooding with dorks was more like: 1/1 and 1 more mana next turn or Emrakul

[Borg]

I was pleasantly surprised by the effectiveness of the changes that were  suggested/made.
Utopia Sprawl worked nicely and invites for the use of Arbor Elf instead of a regular 1-mana elf.

Steely Resolve slides in nicely at just two mana and takes away considerable pressure. It gives you more time/turns to build up without risking everything.

The 4 Caverns also showed up consistently and never hindered.

You guys deserved an upvote

Revision 42

Added/removed cards:
-4 Fyndhorn Elves
-4 Joraga Treespeaker
-4 Llanowar Elves
+4 Arbor Elf
+4 Steely Resolve
+4 Utopia Sprawl

Changed amounts:

[Borg]

Green remains vulnerable due to the fact that they have few options to disrupt their opponent.
Steely Resolve eliminates a big part of the "sitting duck" problem.
I added Ezuri, Renegade Leader as he can help against earthquake effects and he can quickly decide a game as well with his +3/+3 trample-for-all ability.

To disrupt and buy some time I'm going back to the tried and tested Plow Under.

Revision 43

Added/removed cards:
+1 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
+3 Plow Under

Changed amounts:
-1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
-2 Green Sun's Zenith
-1 Reclamation Sage

[Snook-Zulu]

ah finally there is the Steely Resolve good choice

[Borg]

Eladamri, Lord of Leaves replaces Steely Resolve ( how could I have missed this one so long ? )

Song of the Dryads is some form of removal and creates the potential for Forestwalk which Eladamri provides.

Growing Rites of Itlimoc provides card draw and another Gaea's Cradle.




Revision 44

Added/removed cards:
-1 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
-1 Reclamation Sage
-4 Steely Resolve
+3 Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
+1 Growing Rites of Itlimoc
+2 Song of the Dryads

Changed amounts:

[Borg]

Song of the Dryads is a fantastic card in this deck. More wanted.
Thing in the Ice threatening to bounce all your Elves ?
Just turn the thing into a simple Forest.

That leaves me with a single spot to fill.
I'll try Garruk Wildspeaker.
Ability to untap Gaea's Cradle and cast overrun after just surviving one round seems powerful and in line with this deck. I'll see how it goes.

Revision 45

Added/removed cards:
-3 Plow Under
+1 Garruk Wildspeaker

Changed amounts:
+2 Song of the Dryads

[Borg]

One of the main attraction points of magic : you can keep tuning and improving your deck even when you thought you were already "there".

Soren was right, I don't need 4 Emrakul.
Actually, I now think I don't even need three or two but just one.
The point is : if you can ramp up alright to 15 mana it's nice to have Emrakul available
but if you can't ramp up that high ( for whatever reason ) that's 4 dead cards in your deck.
Therefore, I think you need only 1 while you maximize the chances to get one :
meaning 1 Emrakul and 4 Worldly Tutors to get him.
That still gives you 5 chances to get him but the tutors can be used differently if need be and now you have a maximum of only 1 potential dead Emrakul card in your deck.

I also further tuned the T1 mana drops.
I figure 10 could/should be enough : 4 Arbor Elf, 4 Utopia Sprawl and 2 Elvish Mystic.
Dropped two Mystics.
This allows me to add Dwynen and Ezuri.

The two Emrakuls that were taken out were replaced by 2 Green Sun's Zenith upping their total back to 4. The Zeniths are no card loss as they are shuffled back into your deck and give you great odds to get exactly what you want on the table.

Stay tuned


Revision 46

Added/removed cards:
+1 Dwynen, Gilt-Leaf Daen
+1 Ezuri, Renegade Leader

Changed amounts:
-2 Elvish Mystic
-2 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
+2 Green Sun's Zenith

[Soren841]

Nice job with the deck

[Falkenrath]

Hello, this is my first post here.

I am a legacy elf combo player, so this thread interests me greatly. What are your thoughts on the pros and cons of your build versus the established Glimpse-Combo, Natural order decks using Craterhoof Behemoth as a game ender?

Have you considered adding black to your deck and using the Deathrite Shaman, Fetchlands, Bayou, and Abrupt Decay package?

Generally speaking, Deathrite offers you much more utility in your main deck than Elvish Mystics. It includes mana ramp as well as graveyard hate and an alternate source of damage for the grindy games.

You could limit your forests and Cavern of Souls and raise the total lands in the deck to 20 to allow for a more regular land draw. The fetch lands also allow you to thin your deck slightly at a very minimal cost of 1 life and every land in the garveyard can be used by Deathrite as future mana (don't forget you can eat your opponents lands too, get rid of those pesky wastelands). Something like 4 Cradle, 2 caverns, 8 Green Fetches, 2 bayou, 4 Forests would work nicely. (This is very similar to my land base, except I have on 1 cavern, 2 forests, 9 fetches, and 2 dryad arbor). If you feel like 8 fetches is too many, you can always reduce the number and increase Forests or Caverns to adjust.

The addition of B to the deck would vastly open up your sideboard options for disruption. Thoughtseize, Abrupt Decay, Cabal Therapy, and more.

[Borg]

Hi Falkenrath,

If this is the kind of posts you'll make over here , welcome

Hello, this is my first post here.

I am a legacy elf combo player, so this thread interests me greatly. What are your thoughts on the pros and cons of your build versus the established Glimpse-Combo, Natural order decks using Craterhoof Behemoth as a game ender?

I'd say those Natural Order decks are more combo oriented than my build, which I consider more aggro.
The Order builds are definitely fast and if they go off, it's over but they may be easier to stop.
Correct me if I'm wrong please, but if you can somehow stop Craterhoof Behemoth from hitting the table they are in trouble.
I'm thinking counters of course but also Meddling Mage or Circu, Dimir Lobotomist or Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver, Glimpse the unthinkable etc... Fast and powerful but also fragile and with no defense to speak of if the deck does not go off for some reason.

My build was originally built to ramp up asap towards Emrakul but I've scaled that part down over the last few weeks ( with the help of these excellent posters here )
I can still get Emrakul out as fast as T3 with the right hand and uninterrupted but the focus has shifted more towards the Joraga Warcallers lately.
Between them, the Elvish Archdruids and Dwynen they can boost those elves quickly and become a force to be reckoned with.
Get a couple of 5 mana Warcallers out together with an Archdruid and you're giving those little Elves +5/+5.
So, overall I'd consider my build also quite fast but with more potential threats and multiple means to win the game.

The Shroud, provided by Eladamri, Lord of Leaves is another element that should make my deck more resistant to some types of opposition, I think.

Have you considered adding black to your deck and using the Deathrite Shaman, Fetchlands, Bayou, and Abrupt Decay package?

Short answer : no, I hadn't and this is a great suggestion.
As I mentioned above, the deck was originally designed to ramp up asap to 15 mana for Emrakul and thus mono green and lots of elves to boost Priest of Titania and Elvish Archdruid was my original goal.
But as the focus of the deck has shifted, adding black would very likely be an improvement.
You have earned yourself some Karma, Sir.
Updated deck forthcoming.

The mana base is a bit of a concern though.
Bayou is risky ( Wasteland ) and Bayou with Utopia Sprawl on it may be too much of a risk to take.
Otoh Utopia Sprawl gives me 4 additional potential black mana sources.

[Borg]

Revision 48

Added/removed cards:
-2 Elvish Mystic
-1 Growing Rites of Itlimoc
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Bayou
+2 Deathrite Shaman
+4 Verdant Catacombs
+1 Wirewood Lodge

Changed amounts:
-1 Cavern of Souls
-6 Forest
-1 Song of the Dryads