Universes Beyond

[Morganator 2.0]

Back in late February there was an announcement made for a new product called Universes Beyond. These sets will include cards from other fantasy/sci-fi settings, other than the MTG universe. The Walking Dead secret lair is going to retroactively be made into a universes beyond set. At some point there is going to be a Warhammer 40k expansion and a Lord of the Rings expansion.

What are your opinions on this? Is this something you're excited for, or is it something you'd rather not see?

[ekans_]

I don't play the format in which those cards would become legal, but I would be very unhappy if I had to play a Warhammer or The Walking Dead card in my modern deck, just because the alternatives aren't as good.

On one hand I would want my deck to be as competitive as possible as long it remains executing the gameplan I first anticipated, but on the other hand I wouldn't like to be "forced" by WotC to play with a Warhammer card in my MtG deck.

I am just happy that it's not coming to the format I play (for now) so I don't have to think about making this decision of my deck either being as competitive or as "magic" as possible.

[terminalgeek]

It's the beginning of Hasbro using MtG like Monopoly.

[Korlich]

It's absolutly awfull. I hope these cards gets banned in EDH and Pauper, the formats I play.

[WizardSpartan]

In that article, WotC didn't give a straight answer, saying cards from Universes Beyond will both be reskins and new cards, so I have differing opinions for each.

For cards that are just alters of existing cards -> I love the idea and am excited for what WotC comes up with.

If the cards are new and exclusive to Universes Beyond -> I think this is absolutely disgusting. Mechanically unique cards shouldn't be in limited sets, this is making Magic feel commercial gameplay-wise, blah blah blah. I feel the same as the community. If we have more sets like TWD, I will definitely start getting scared about the longevity of Magic. Currently, I hope to continue purchasing and playing Magic for a long time, but I think stuff like TWD will begin running MTG into the ground unless the Rules Committee starts banning them from EDH (which won't be happening).

[Slyvester12]

I absolutely love Warhammer and LotR, and I mentioned in a previous post that something like Dune would lend itself to set design pretty easily. However, I really don't like the idea of black bordered magic cards with Adeptus Astartes marines, Gandalf, and Shai-Hulud all in the same deck.

Magic is great because the different planes always manage to feel like they belong in the greater scope of the game's story (by this I mean less the actual story novels and more the general art/themes in magic), but adding new, highly recognizable, and disparate franchises sounds like the game will lose that sense of cohesion. If magic introduced technology worshipping superhumans in power armor (I was going to say wizards and giant worms, but we already have wizards and wurms), it would feel like another plane that could interact with another part of magic. Like how any plane can suffer from a Phyrexian invasion or a sudden appearance of the Avengers superfriends.

Elesh Norn showing up in Ravnica or Zendikar makes sense because that character's story develops with the idea that those planes exist, even if the development team didn't have concrete ideas of eventually fitting them together. If Aragorn found himself in Innistrad, his first thought would probably not be "Hey, let's fight all the vampires and other scary things with the other humans." His character just doesn't fit. He wasn't written with the abilities of magic's other characters or the whole multiplanar setting in mind.

I feel like I'm ranting at this point, so tldr: booo.

[ApothecaryGeist]

In that article, WotC didn't give a straight answer, saying cards from Universes Beyond will both be reskins and new cards, so I have differing opinions for each.

For cards that are just alters of existing cards -> I love the idea and am excited for what WotC comes up with.

If the cards are new and exclusive to Universes Beyond -> I think this is absolutely disgusting. Mechanically unique cards shouldn't be in limited sets, this is making Magic feel commercial gameplay-wise, blah blah blah. I feel the same as the community. If we have more sets like TWD, I will definitely start getting scared about the longevity of Magic. Currently, I hope to continue purchasing and playing Magic for a long time, but I think stuff like TWD will begin running MTG into the ground unless the Rules Committee starts banning them from EDH (which won't be happening).

Ditto.


Agree 100%.


Booooo  - Mechanically unique non-Magic IP


Meh - reskinned Magic cards.

[Potato Chop]

I myself am a fan of reskinned cards that represent characters and elements from non-Magic IPs. Think back to the Godzilla stuff going around in Ikoria - that was great! They were black-bordered, they were Godzilla-branded, and the most important thing is: THEY HAD NON-GODZILLA COUNTERPARTS.
(Except for Zilortha, but that was the Buy-a-Box promo).

If Wizards is going to make entire black-bordered expansions / secret lairs, I hope that they will all either just be reskinned reprints or have mechanically identical cards in nearby "normal" Magic sets. If not, I completely agree that they should 100% be banned. That doesn't stop casual players like myself buying and building them in decks (especially if they're cool commanders). We've seen people build silver-bordered commanders like The Grand Calcutron, and people will build Gandalf Wizards tribal (if that becomes a thing).

I just really hope that Wizards just prints mechanically identical cards in normal expansions.

[jlutzxinc]

Okay...I've read the article and I apologize in advance for the upcoming rant.  Not only do I NOT want more mechanically unique cards in Legacy, but I'm especially scared of the proposed Warhammer 40K Commander Decks.  As if pressing the Rules Commitee into allowing the Walking Dead cards wasn't bad enough, now they're forcing their adult-oriented licensed merchandise on everyone.  If they don't change their minds and make it some other kind of product my playgroup will be taken over by violently competitive types and I will have no choice but to hard-ban those precons in their entirety (if you think I'm overreacting it almost happened once already).  It would be manageable if they only brought in family franchises (I would have allowed the Godzilla crossover even if it was more pushed, and the upcoming D&D set and proposed LOTR crossover sound great); going straight into product that only appeals to warmongers is an "accident" waiting to happen, and I'm very tired of people who only want to wreck @$$ and don't think a GAME should be FUN turning up everywhere I go.  I only ever considered Commander because it's a casual format and the game I quit for it didn't have one, and I've found A LOT of like-minded people to play with.

[Korlich]

Why not just make it silverbordered? I would love to play in those types of universes, but don't make it a part of the core product. WoTC/Hasbro need to trust their own products. Most ppl who play the Un-series also play regular magic, but Un- is silverbordered.

[robort]

My opinion is... There are going to be new mechanics in those types of sets. We see new mechanics presented all the time and some are short lived and others live longer. The Universes Beyond set(s) are going to be doing exactly that bringing in new mechanics. I like seeing new mechanics and what they can or can't do. There is that new "Learn" mechanic which can't be used in commander but does that mean I didn't like seeing it? I liked seeing it but that doesn't mean it would stop me from playing commander and having fun. There is a new mechanic in the 2021 Commander product called "demonstrate" so lets all get in an uproar and yell to high heavens to ban those cards that have this mechanic. The cards that represent the mechanics is where everyone's issue lays. "TWD" has mechanics and need to be banned and would it be any different if those mechanics were represented like "demonstrate" in now it is represented by "Commander 2021"?  Per another example would there be less outroar if "Gandalf" wasn't being a representative but was instead called "The Great Bambino"?

Which brings me to my point. If you are looking to have such cards banned because of gimmicky or product availability then by all means why then isn't this card considered in the same sentence? Allosaurus Shepherd is how much? It is also based upon a gimmick of mashing 2 decks together and having a 40 card mashed deck.

[ApothecaryGeist]

It's not about the gimmick-ness.


First is the concept that you will be "forced" to play with a card from a non-Magic IP.  This is if these are mechanically unique cards.  People feel this breaks the immersion in the game.  I think they also feel that it makes the game sound a bit more childish - "Iron Man uses Magic Wand to exile Chewbacca."  This part I personally understand, but I don't have that much problem with it.


The other issue is one of availability.  WotC could reprint Allosaurus Shepherd in a product tomorrow.  Or any day.  (they likely won't, but they could.)  If WotC prints a card named Mickey Mouse, their rights to print that card will have a limited window.  They will not be able to reprint it.  This is much the same as the Walking Dead Secret Lair.  Those cards can't be reprinted.  This effectively creates a second Reserve List.


It's about WotC creating even more scarcity for their products.

[robort]

Actually there is a possibility of TWD being reprinted. Quote from the article "We may find charming opportunities to do the reskinned versions of existing cards and will continue to balance between the two as we move forward."

Then again they may not. Hard telling not knowing what the future may bring.

[Morganator 2.0]

"Reskinned" as in what happened with the Godzilla cards. They are all based on a magic card that already exists (with one exception). Getting the actual godzilla cards reprinted is unlikely, but all the cards they are based off of can be reprinted.

This is not the same as the universes beyond product, hence why that last part ("[...] will continue to balance between the two as we move forward.") Is included. They are two separate types of products.

[robort]

"Reskinned" as in what happened with the Godzilla cards. They are all based on a magic card that already exists (with one exception). Getting the actual godzilla cards reprinted is unlikely, but all the cards they are based off of can be reprinted.

This is not the same as the universes beyond product, hence why that last part ("[...] will continue to balance between the two as we move forward.") Is included. They are two separate types of products.

Once again skip over the important parts. There will also be the occasional standalone product like The Walking Dead, but the intention is to typically make Universes Beyond as available as any other Magic product.[/u][/i]