Meren golgari combo

[KingKia]

Hi everybody,
here is my meren golgari combo primer.

I look forward to your suggestions and constructive criticism

https://deckstats.net/decks/118014/2243181-meren-of-golgari-combo#show_description

[AenimaD]

Just to consider: the mikaeus + ballista combo doesn't work that way, as ballista gets +1/+1 from Mikaeus. It works with triskelion, though, which is a great combo.

The other requirements for combos are a bit too specific for my taste.

Check nim deathmantle + grave titan and ashnods altar if you didn't know it yet and feel free to have a look at my own meren deck.

[KingKia]

Just to consider: the mikaeus + ballista combo doesn't work that way, as ballista gets +1/+1 from Mikaeus. It works with triskelion, though, which is a great combo.

Which combo do you mean? That one with protean Hulk? If  yes than could you kindly explain why it doesnt work?
Ballista will get +1/+1 from Mikaeus and a +1/+1 counter. So Ballista is a 2/2 if I remove a 1/1 counter he is a 1/1 and if I use this counter to dmg himself he will die or am I wrong?

[Morganator 2.0]

Just to consider: the mikaeus + ballista combo doesn't work that way, as ballista gets +1/+1 from Mikaeus. It works with triskelion, though, which is a great combo.

Which combo do you mean? That one with protean Hulk? If  yes than could you kindly explain why it doesnt work?
Ballista will get +1/+1 from Mikaeus and a +1/+1 counter. So Ballista is a 2/2 if I remove a 1/1 counter he is a 1/1 and if I use this counter to dmg himself he will die or am I wrong?

You're missing a step here. This combo needs a sac outlet in order for it to work. Otherwise you have an infinite sac loop but no payoff. You did specify this in the primer itself, but it's not very clear.

[KingKia]

Just to consider: the mikaeus + ballista combo doesn't work that way, as ballista gets +1/+1 from Mikaeus. It works with triskelion, though, which is a great combo.

Which combo do you mean? That one with protean Hulk? If  yes than could you kindly explain why it doesnt work?
Ballista will get +1/+1 from Mikaeus and a +1/+1 counter. So Ballista is a 2/2 if I remove a 1/1 counter he is a 1/1 and if I use this counter to dmg himself he will die or am I wrong?

You're missing a step here. This combo needs a sac outlet in order for it to work. Otherwise you have an infinite sac loop but no payoff. You did specify this in the primer itself, but it's not very clear.

Well the infinite sac loop is the infinite combo there because in the primer I mentioned that for this combo zulaport cutthroat or the blood artist is needed on the battlefield. I don't know how to write that any more clearly either to be honest.
Or are we talking about another infinite combination within the primer and I'm just don´t get it?

[The Golgari Guy]

The combo as explained in the primer looks fine. You get infinite death triggers so with a pinger you can win the game.

My suggestion for you: I'd cut Talisman of Resilience, Farseek, Nature's Lore and Three Visits. You want most of your ramp to be creature-based in Meren, to take full advantage of synergies with Grim Haruspex, Guardian Project and similar.

You can play more mana dorks as Elves of Deep Shadow and Llanowar Elves, and also Dawntreader Elk is pretty good with Meren since you can recur it. Also consider 3-mana ramp, such as Wood Elves and Yavimaya Granger. Slower ramp than mana dorks, but more resilient to board wipes.

Also, you have many tutors but you're a bit light on card draw. Despite yours being a combo deck, I'd still play 2 more sources of card draw. Yawgmoth, Thran Physician and Midnight Reaper are two great card draw engines in Meren.

[AenimaD]

Yeah, sorry for not being more specific. I just wanted to point out that ballista + mikaeus on itself won't do much.

[KingKia]

The combo as explained in the primer looks fine. You get infinite death triggers so with a pinger you can win the game.

Thank you, I I thought I forgot something or did something wrong.

My suggestion for you: I'd cut Talisman of Resilience, Farseek, Nature's Lore and Three Visits. You want most of your ramp to be creature-based in Meren, to take full advantage of synergies with Grim Haruspex, Guardian Project and similar.
You can play more mana dorks as Elves of Deep Shadow and Llanowar Elves, and also Dawntreader Elk is pretty good with Meren since you can recur it. Also consider 3-mana ramp, such as Wood Elves and Yavimaya Granger. Slower ramp than mana dorks, but more resilient to board wipes.

A very good point (as you would expect from someone called the the golgari guy).
The main reason why I´m not running that much of dorks is that I don't want to aggravate the bottleneck from this deck by make everything in this deck creature based. In Germany there is a saying: "don't put all your eggs in one basket", that means if your basket falls on the floor you will lose all your eggs (not sure if this makes sense in english tbh but nvm :-D). I don´t wanna lose all my mana into a mass removal or gravehate or to cards like humility, cursed totem or linvala, keeper of silence. So I need and want an other way to ramp to be more flexible and the 2 mana sorceries are some of the fastest and best ramp spells there in my opinion. They also don´t have summoners sickness so you can use the lands from Three visits and nature's lore in the same turn if needed.
But Talisman of Resilience can easily be swapped out for elves of deep shadow (I like the fact that a green creature can make black mana, because to play this card you need a green mana source which means you have green mana on board and with this dork you can bring a black mana source in game to fix your mana). I think I will accept your suggestion on this point. Thanks for this great feedback

Also, you have many tutors but you're a bit light on card draw. Despite yours being a combo deck, I'd still play 2 more sources of card draw. Yawgmoth, Thran Physician and Midnight Reaper are two great card draw engines in Meren.

Well another very good point here. I like the idea to play Yawgmoth, Thran Physician instead of vampiric rites. He is a creature, he has a sac ability, the sac ability can be used by necrotic ooze as well, he can sac for just 1 life and no mana is needed and last but not least, you can distribute some -1/-1 counter and kill some stuff as well.
Midnight reaper is also a great card in this deck but as I already mentioned, I don´t think that I need that much of card draw in this deck and don´t forget that asmodeus is also a draw option in this deck even if this card is not in the cdraw section.

Again thanks for this great feedback I hope my explanations were understandable and I was able to explain my point well.

I´ll add this into the primer soon.

[The Golgari Guy]

No problem man.

If you're afraid of Cursed Totem and Linvala, you could try cards like Wood Elves and Yavimaya Granger. They can be pretty great with the recursion of Meren. Note that Wood Elves also gives you an untapped forest into play, and Granger triggers Meren without the need for a sac outlet.

I guess in the end it's a personal decision. I always try to maximise synergy, and I know that this can lead to big blowouts if someone plays something like a Cursed Totem (or a Rest in Peace, or Torpor Orb, or Leyline of the Void...). However it has rarely happened to me to meet such cards in a game, since their effect is pretty niche and not many people run them. So I'd argue that it's worth the risk, but this of course depends heavily on your meta.

Btw this is my Meren list, in case it could give you some ideas. I don't run combos on purpose though, and focus on a midrange/attrition strategy.

https://deckstats.net/decks/149180/1755348-meren-aristocrats-midrange

[KingKia]

No problem man.

If you're afraid of Cursed Totem and Linvala, you could try cards like Wood Elves and Yavimaya Granger. They can be pretty great with the recursion of Meren. Note that Wood Elves also gives you an untapped forest into play, and Granger triggers Meren without the need for a sac outlet.

I guess in the end it's a personal decision. I always try to maximise synergy, and I know that this can lead to big blowouts if someone plays something like a Cursed Totem (or a Rest in Peace, or Torpor Orb, or Leyline of the Void...). However it has rarely happened to me to meet such cards in a game, since their effect is pretty niche and not many people run them. So I'd argue that it's worth the risk, but this of course depends heavily on your meta.

I think it depends on the goal of the deck and also on the meta in which the deck should perform. Maximizing the synergy is absolutely correct but for me maximizing is a combination of synergy and flexibility to allow the deck to answer on different cards and also still perform in different situations. I looked at your meren and also liked it because I think your deck is very good, nevertheless your deck is very different from mine, because I try to win quickly with combos. That leads to the fact that I play more tutors and also try to be able to win independently of meren and the typical meren cards.

Wood Elves and Yavimaya Granger are both great in this deck and I have already looked at these cards and also considered playing them. However, I decided against 3 mana creature-based ramp to make the deck faster and less susceptible to certain cards or mechanics.

Btw this is my Meren list, in case it could give you some ideas. I don't run combos on purpose though, and focus on a midrange/attrition strategy.

https://deckstats.net/decks/149180/1755348-meren-aristocrats-midrange

Yep I´ve already checked and liked your deck :-)

I´ll also add malakir rebirth (completely forgot that this card exists, dunno why)
And I´m thinking of swapping dance of the dead for Journey to eternity. But I think that dance of the dead is better because I just wanna go for my combo and can bring necrotig ooze or what ever I needed back from graveyard while Journey to eternity has a similiar effekt like malakir rebirth. I think I should test it.

[KingKia]

Yeah, sorry for not being more specific. I just wanted to point out that ballista + mikaeus on itself won't do much.

No worries, I thought you are talking about a specific combo within the primer, so I was a bit confused and tried to explain :-)
But yeah Ballista + Mikaeus on itself won't do much you are right

[The Golgari Guy]

And I´m thinking of swapping dance of the dead for Journey to eternity. But I think that dance of the dead is better because I just wanna go for my combo and can bring necrotig ooze or what ever I needed back from graveyard while Journey to eternity has a similiar effekt like malakir rebirth. I think I should test it.

I think Dance of the Dead is stronger in your deck. Maybe you could also consider Persist ?

[KingKia]

I think Dance of the Dead is stronger in your deck. Maybe you could also consider Persist ?

Yeah I think I´ll play dance of the dead. Persist is a nice idea but I think the other reanimation spells are still stronger.

I also updated the primer :-)

[The Golgari Guy]

I think Dance of the Dead is stronger in your deck. Maybe you could also consider Persist ?

Yeah I think I´ll play dance of the dead. Persist is a nice idea but I think the other reanimation spells are still stronger.

I also updated the primer :-)

Cool! Yes, DotD is better for sure, I was just suggesting Persist in case you wanted one more reanimation spell

[KingKia]

Cool! Yes, DotD is better for sure, I was just suggesting Persist in case you wanted one more reanimation spell

Yeah it is a good recommendation. I'll test and if I need more reanimation spells, I'll try persist. I just don´t like the restriction "non legendary" but have to test it first.