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Author Topic: Undead Unleashed Editing  (Read 8858 times)

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #45 on: November 05, 2021, 06:21:39 pm »
While I can see some reason in cutting Larder Zombie, cutting my ramp options, and especially one that works with Havengul Lich, is not so great an idea. Vesper Ghoul's going nowhere for anything but another highly flexible ramp option. At the moment I've been looking at Rotten Reunion and Swan Song as potential cuts for Wash Away, but Larder Zombie is in consideration now too.
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth would be somewhat nice, yes, but it is well outside the budget. There's also almost no synergy to that card and this deck as is. That budget issue's the same reason Unholy Grotto is still sitting on the Maybeboard. The few things in this deck over the $10 limit are ones I had already, or caught at or before hitting that limit.
Zombie Master is similarly overbudget, though not so much so that it would necessarily be difficult to find a copy low enough in quality to drop below that due to age. The bigger issue is the threat it poses to me. Unlike most Lords, Zombie Master is not limited to just helping you. If anyone else is running Zombies, which let's get real is pretty common due to the tribe's popularity, that leaves me open to them. Flying, Menace, and to an extent Deathtouch are all more reliable methods of evasion in this deck that don't depend on what lands my opponents have or that I buy and pull out one specific land.
Zombie Trailblazer, even ignoring the Swampwalk and Ashaya killing utility, also allows me to more safely attack into someone with open mana by using a few zombies that couldn't or shouldn't attack that turn anyway and disrupt the mana supply before combat.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2021, 07:03:43 pm by Landale »

Loggiu

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #46 on: November 05, 2021, 08:10:39 pm »
You can also draw with Slate of Ancestry....Is better against blood moon than vesper ghoul

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #47 on: November 05, 2021, 08:13:44 pm »
I'm not even sure what you're trying to say there.

Loggiu

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #48 on: November 05, 2021, 08:35:21 pm »
You have a lot of basic land and a lot of tokens, is colorless, so you draw 4-5 cards, probably find a basicland!!!!

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #49 on: November 05, 2021, 08:43:49 pm »
8 mana and pitch my hand for a chance to find a basic land depending entirely on my current board state vs 3 mana for a mana dork that takes just one life and gets me any color at all, thus having synergy with Havengul Lich.
Your point that I have a lot of basic lands is entirely against needing some incredibly awkward method of protecting myself from a Blood Moon. Additionally, I have a Corpse Harvester capable of finding both a land and a zombie of my choice for a token and 7 mana with no loss to my hand, as well as a Dreamscape Artist which would be capable of disposing of one of those now mostly useless nonbasics in your scenario for two basic lands at the cost of 5 mana and only one other card.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2021, 09:44:02 pm by Landale »

Loggiu

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #50 on: November 05, 2021, 09:55:18 pm »
But Make You also draw a lot of cards with the tokens!!!!!! >:(

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #51 on: November 05, 2021, 10:17:52 pm »
Drawing a lot of cards that I won't have the mana for because I spent it all drawing them so now I'm going to just dump them. There is a reason Slate of Ancestry is primarily found in Red or Green decks, they reliably have the mana to do stupidly overcosted things like that.

Let me just save us both a massive headache; Unless you can name a card better about drawing than the ones currently doing that in the deck and explain exactly how it is better, "X is better than Species Specialist because Y" for example, I don't want to hear it. 10% of my deck is able to get me cards in some way or another. I. Do. Not. Need. Nor. Want. More.

Loggiu

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #52 on: November 05, 2021, 10:32:24 pm »
Did You Know if Pubs open at 5 A.M.????

Morganator 2.0

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #53 on: November 05, 2021, 10:54:41 pm »
That's completely off-topic and unrelated to this deck. Let's move the conversation back into the realm of relevancy.

I've noticed that this deck isn't using a lot of removal. Has that been a problem for you so far, or does the deck fair just fine without it? And if you are looking for removal, I highly recommend Fleshbag Marauder as it has a lot of synergies with some of the cards you're using, including Wilhelt.

And how effective are Falcon Abomination and Ghastly Gloomhunter? A lot of your lord effects give some kind of evasion already (or deathtouch, which is pseudo evasion) which makes me think that something like Eternal Skylord or Gleaming Overseer might be more relevant. "Might" being the key word, as these lords would only buff your tokens, and not other zombies.

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #54 on: November 05, 2021, 11:45:09 pm »
Lack of removal hasn't been too much of a problem, better just nipping things in the bud with counters. Removal tends to get tossed at other players, my assumption being the though is "that stuff's dying one way or the other as is so save it for more permanent problems over there", so people tend to do the work for me in that regard. Board wipes are what end up hitting me the most, which is part of why I'm not too concerned about getting Hexproof and the like in here. I do have Blood on the Snow on the Maybeboard, accidentally clicked it off in a previous revision, couldn't figure out how to work it in though. I had also been using Jarl of the Forsaken and Feed the Swarm, but they weren't doing much. I replaced Feed the Swarm with Callous Dismissal to retain some level of removal that also has use in repeating ETBs or moving my Curse around to someone else. Liliana, Death's Majesty had also been left in for a bit but drew a lot of attention and is still in the Maybeboard,

Falcon Abomination gets really stupid when Cleaver Skaab gets ahold of it, up 3 Zombies for 3 mana. That was my main reason for putting that in in place of Hobbling Zombie. Ghastly Gloomhunter is mostly a leftover I haven't found a good replacement to cut it for yet as my self harming cards gradually got cut down and life gain was less relevant. A Flying Lifelinker as is isn't awful anyway, especially with a couple lords out so I haven't been in a rush.
Eternal Skylord doesn't particularly appeal to me, as I've stated earlier, due to the high cost, limited application of flying, and lack of utility compared to Geralf, Visionary Stitcher and Hordewing Skaab. Gleaming Overseer isn't quite so bad, being significantly cheaper. I'm just not really sure how to fit it in.

Revision 40

Finished up my most recent update, just switching Rotten Reunion out for Wash Away and correcting the Maybeboard.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2021, 11:49:17 pm by Landale »

Morganator 2.0

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #55 on: November 06, 2021, 12:35:56 am »
Alright, a replacement for Ghastly Gloomhunter... besides the Fleshbag Marauder.

The first one that comes to mind is Shepherd of Rot. It's about the same mana cost, and has synergy with the zombie tribal thing you've got going on. The downside is that it is a symmetrical effect, but as long as you can be more aggressive than your opponents it shouldn't b much of an issue.

Custodi Lich is an option, but I don't think it will be that effective for you. It's mana cost is a little high, and if you don't need the extra removal, you can safely ignore this.

One you should really consider is Noxious Ghoul. This thing is amazing. I imagine that with Wilhelt's ability it's pretty easy to get more than one zombie entering a turn. Noxious Ghoul can be a one-sided boardwipe, leaving the path clear for you to attack.

Loggiu

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #56 on: November 06, 2021, 01:13:37 am »
I was offended...can you give me back some karma??? People need to think how it's hard to gain karma...the downvote it's terrible...

Landale

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #57 on: November 06, 2021, 01:53:25 am »
Shepherd of Rot was one I had in for a while. It's simple enough to be more aggressive than one opponent, not quite so much against three. Even with the life gain I did have, it rarely offset everyone coming at me to get it to stop. I'm considering putting it back in if I can get a copy of Whip of Erebos.

Custodi Lich definitely seems to expensive for a removal effect I have minimal control over.

Noxious Ghoul is one I do keep thinking about adding, because that is indeed an amazing card, then always forget to put it onto an order somehow.

I'll give the Fleshbag and the Overseer a few test runs in the Gloomhunter's place and see how it goes.

WWolfe

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #58 on: November 06, 2021, 12:28:46 pm »
Thoughts on Repository Skaab?

This space for rent.

robort

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Re: Undead Unleashed Editing
« Reply #59 on: November 06, 2021, 02:27:58 pm »
Great idea with Wilhelt, the Rotcleaver. I was coming up with an idea with this commander using ETB triggers, Panharmonicon, Cleaver Skaab, Reflections of Littjara (which upon reading this thread there is another version that costs less mana) and Dire Undercurrents . I am trying to stay away from any of the combos such as the ones pertaining to do with Poppet Stitcher // Poppet Factory. I was trying also some type of recursion effect as well with stuff like Victimize, Ebondeath, Dracolich, and Master of Death. Not sure if you are interested though in Crowded Crypt but I figure if stuff is dying that I may as well utilize stuff dying and make more zombies
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